A new machine?

[toxo]

38 minutes ago, mikesc said:

Like I said..don't know them..take some leather ( thicker than you think you'll need to sew in the next 12 months or so ) and test it..not the direct drive one..Agree with Brian.."very vague spec"..Is that a "But" enough ?

You're so mean. Not a bone in sight.

[dikman]

I can't find any further information on it - manual, specs, reviews etc - which is a bit surprising. There is a model with a binder attached, which makes me wonder if this is simply another 335-type clone, plus 8mm foot lift is the same as a 335. They refer to needle-feed, not compound feed, and my guess is the feed dog is back and forth only.

Sorry, toxo, but I agree with RockyAussie, it appears to be the same as the others and if so not really suited to what you want.

[Matt S]

@Toxo, if you really want a bone/but, and at risk of being a negative Nelly... it's still a Chinese clone of the 335 (the old casting, too) and 50% higher than your initial budget! Plus I'm typically dubious about salespeople who instantly drop the price -- makes me think that the item was either overpriced to begin with or they desperately need to clear inventory. However, knowing the demographic that Tysew typically sells to, I would not be surprised if a certain "expected/automatic discount" to be built into the pricing structure so ::shrug::.

Do you envisage needing the 50mm "nose" of a small cylinder machine, or would a 75mm "nose" large cylinder machine do? Large cylinders tend to have larger bobbins and 4-motion feed dogs -- there's really not much real-estate inside a small cylinder arm. Some large cylinder machines have a narrowing of the end, where you can smoosh the work into a different shape and sew very close to the edge. or a fairly small radius. Like this example Brian showed to page 1: 

If you do end up coming round this side of the M25 give me a shout, I'm about halfway between Konsew and Tysew. There'll be a brew and a biscuit waiting for you (and maybe, if you're lucky, a go on some of my machines...)

Alternatively if you're looking for a decent dealer a bit closer to you try Maury Sewing in Bethnal Green. Old fashioned place that I've never managed to drag myself to, as I know I'd be remortgaging the cat if I did so, he gets his hands on some amazing gear that I would covet like the nerd I am. Highly recommended to me by several people who I hold in great esteem.

[RockyAussie]

The BUT is The low 8mm thickness it can take . Without a skiver you have to take into account how often you will have multiple thicknesses that end up too tight for the work. Your bag I am sure has more than that in places. Am I right? Now the binder type versions of these machines as in the normal 335 machines have a wider platform needle plate area to assist with holding the binding tape. That means also that the needle is 9mm from the edge not 6 or 7 mm. That means many gusset jobs just will not work very well, if at all. To visually identify the binder type styles look for the protruding tab as shown in the below picture .

Machines with elliptical feed dogs will normally look like this one kindly provided by Ron at Techsew. This needle in this case is about 7mm from edge.

You can see in the video above some nice looking binding work but Note: there is only one layer of leather in there and if you add to that some lining and another layer of leather and lining plus the binding itself you are quickly running out of space.

Here below I am stitching a binder onto this product and this required a lot of skiving on edges to enable this thickness to be possible

Note at the bottom of zip more thicknesses to accommodate

Now turned in the right side out you can see a LOT more thicknesses had to be fitted in as well

This motorcycle tool bag edge could not be sewn on a binder type machine due to needle tooo far from edge.

SOOOOO the BUT is unless you are planning on a skiver in the budget pretty quick..... Go bigger. There are cheap ones there as well.

 

[RockyAussie]

This picture below may give a better perspective of the distance from the edge to the needle on a typical binder set up (9mm). This is a pic from when I was making some smaller cylinder caps for all the machines.

This pic of an Adler 69 shows also a binder set up feed dog but I have done a lot off sanding with an angle grinder to get what I wanted at the time. Including the feet as well in this case.

[toxo]

Where to start? I know enough to take what a dealer says with a pinch of salt and I will be on the phone tomorrow. I made him check the needle to edge and he said 7mm. I also asked him the sewing thickness of veg tan and he said 12mm. The foot lift is 15mm. Harry Rogers uses a Tysew on youtube and it looks ok but frustratingly it doesn't show the model number. Check the end of the cylinder at 9:10 mins in.

The Monte Carlo bag is 2mm Bridle and 2.4mm veg tan. Not that it matters, it's all hand stitched but your point is taken Brian and I'm glad you guys are keeping me on point. I can't afford to buy a lemon.

After what you guys said I had another look at Harrys machine and it does look like a binder plate on top doesn't it?

 

 

Edited March 13, 2020 by toxo

[toxo]

1 hour ago, Matt S said:

@Toxo, if you really want a bone/but, and at risk of being a negative Nelly... it's still a Chinese clone of the 335 (the old casting, too) and 50% higher than your initial budget! Plus I'm typically dubious about salespeople who instantly drop the price -- makes me think that the item was either overpriced to begin with or they desperately need to clear inventory. However, knowing the demographic that Tysew typically sells to, I would not be surprised if a certain "expected/automatic discount" to be built into the pricing structure so ::shrug::.

Do you envisage needing the 50mm "nose" of a small cylinder machine, or would a 75mm "nose" large cylinder machine do? Large cylinders tend to have larger bobbins and 4-motion feed dogs -- there's really not much real-estate inside a small cylinder arm. Some large cylinder machines have a narrowing of the end, where you can smoosh the work into a different shape and sew very close to the edge. or a fairly small radius. Like this example Brian showed to page 1: 

If you do end up coming round this side of the M25 give me a shout, I'm about halfway between Konsew and Tysew. There'll be a brew and a biscuit waiting for you (and maybe, if you're lucky, a go on some of my machines...)

Alternatively if you're looking for a decent dealer a bit closer to you try Maury Sewing in Bethnal Green. Old fashioned place that I've never managed to drag myself to, as I know I'd be remortgaging the cat if I did so, he gets his hands on some amazing gear that I would covet like the nerd I am. Highly recommended to me by several people who I hold in great esteem.

I may take you up on that cuppa Matt. PM me your number.

I did notice a Bethnal Green number among my searching and I meant to give them a call but when I tried to find them again I couldn't.

[RockyAussie]

1 hour ago, toxo said:

After what you guys said I had another look at Harrys machine and it does look like a binder plate on top doesn't it?

No at about 9minutes in you can not see the tab sticking through as I showed in the earlier pictures which I would take that machine to be a oscillating feed dog set up. Also a binder top plate usually has a series of prongs sticking up to feed the tape through with a little tension. Note also that Harry is doing this without a lining and skiving is also quite apparent.

[dikman]

I would say that the machine Harry is using is the same one, but it does have an oscillating feed dog. If you watch the cutout to the right of the needle you can see the round bit (screw?) moving up, down, back and forth. IF you go to look at it and feel it is suitable make sure it has the oscillating feed dog.

There's no doubt it will do what you want but as Brian said the potential limiting factor may ultimately be clearance under the feet. I have an old casting 335 and have actually increased the working clearance under the feet BUT mine has a manual thread tension release, because what happens is that as the foot lifts higher it operates the tension release at the top of each stroke IF you have the normal automatic pin release. So don't let anyone tell you it's a simple matter to increase the clearance.

[Constabulary]

also - do you notice the beeeeeeeep sound while he is sewing? It comes from the motor - I had one of these "beeeper" servo motors and I found it totally annoying and sold the motor. I could not stand it on longer projects. back then seller said it will disappear - but it did not! So check what motor you will have on the machine.

Edited March 13, 2020 by Constabulary