Help with sharpening my tools

[sonataworks]

Hey all,

Just wondering if you guys do anything special to sharpen your tools.

I've been using a leather strop with some green compound but it doesn't have the "great" effect that other people seem to be having. I just purchased a brand new L'indispensable knife but the edge came out blunter than my Stanley knife.

I haven't really moved onto stone grinding yet, as I'm afraid of ruining the edge by holding it at the wrong angle. Right now I've just been doing passes of the knife onto the strop for a little bit better of an edge, but not by much.

Another issue is definitely with my edge bevelers. Been having problems with the sharpness of those for a long time. And while I haven't bought Palosantos, I haven't been buying cheap tools either (Japanese variant of the Tandy Pro line).

I've tried using a tool like this with some 800 grit sandpaper, but I find it does not do much before the sandpaper rips on the tool. Not sure if I've ruined my beveler even with one of these tools, because these bevelers are not supposed to lose their edge this quickly.

I've also tried the sandpaper on needle method, and running the beveler down a strop.

Curious to know what works for you guys. Just a lil upsetting to have these beautiful projects marred by a crappy looking edge.

[Rahere]

Japanese tools need Japanese maintenance. Water stones are far more affordable these days, and shaped slips are available.

Keep the wider debate for western tools, please, folks. Different grades of steel.

[sbrownn]

I have a tool similar to the one you mentioned but I use it with 1500 grit wet/dry paper. 

The edgers from Ron's Tools come with a rod correctly sized for the edger you purchase.  I use the rod with 1500 grit paper as well.

I strop my edgers on the edge of a piece of leather I have beveled with the edger I am stropping.  I use the green compound as well.

Sometimes I finish off my edges with a buffing wheel in my dremel tool.  

If your edges are polished to a mirror finish with no scratch marks and they are still dull then you probably need to go back a step and reshape them on a stone.

 

[Bigfoote]

I use Rhynowet sand paper to sharpen my tools all the time. 800 grit is great to start with but way too coarse to finish. I use 2500 to finish my tools with. when you get your tools real sharp, strop them every use and then you won't have to sharpen ever.

[mike02130]

Keep in mind that stropping does not sharpen.  Most if not all new tools need sharpening.  They may cut but they still need work.  Most noticeable with skiving knives.  I bought a new single edged Chartermade blade for my L'indispesable knife.  It was sharp but not sharp enough. I worked it on a series stones starting with coarse.  Most knives don't meet at the point of the cutting edge (apex).  If that is the case you have a couple of options, 1, start with a coarse stone and work your way through the grits to get and maintain a flat bevel.  2, tip the blade so that you are putting a secondary bevel on the blade.  I prefer #1.

I see more people rounding over the edge by improperly stropping--seen too many barber movies.  Once you have a flat edge, find the sweet spot that your edge so it lies flat on the strop and with your index finger on the blade pull it along the strop keeping the edge flat at all times.  Go slowly.  At the end of the pull stop and lift your blade straight up.  Do not round it up.

How soft is the leather on your strop?  Many folks use too soft of a leather on them.  Soft leather does a back sharpen--for lack of a better description--and rounds the edge.  Other than Cordovan, compressed horse butt and kangaroo leather are considered the best.  I use horse butt.   Don't gunk it all up with compound.  I primarily use different grades of compounds on a piece of MDF.

It sounds like it may be time to break out the stones.

[sonataworks]

  On 3/15/2021 at 4:56 PM, Rahere said:

Japanese tools need Japanese maintenance. Water stones are far more affordable these days, and shaped slips are available.

Keep the wider debate for western tools, please, folks. Different grades of steel.

Expand  

Could you expand on this a bit more? The tools I bought did not come with instructions, so I'm not sure what "Japanese maintenance" encompasses.

[chuck123wapati]

  On 3/15/2021 at 4:45 PM, sonataworks said:

Hey all,

Just wondering if you guys do anything special to sharpen your tools.

I've been using a leather strop with some green compound but it doesn't have the "great" effect that other people seem to be having. I just purchased a brand new L'indispensable knife but the edge came out blunter than my Stanley knife.

I haven't really moved onto stone grinding yet, as I'm afraid of ruining the edge by holding it at the wrong angle. Right now I've just been doing passes of the knife onto the strop for a little bit better of an edge, but not by much.

Another issue is definitely with my edge bevelers. Been having problems with the sharpness of those for a long time. And while I haven't bought Palosantos, I haven't been buying cheap tools either (Japanese variant of the Tandy Pro line).

I've tried using a tool like this with some 800 grit sandpaper, but I find it does not do much before the sandpaper rips on the tool. Not sure if I've ruined my beveler even with one of these tools, because these bevelers are not supposed to lose their edge this quickly.

I've also tried the sandpaper on needle method, and running the beveler down a strop.

Curious to know what works for you guys. Just a lil upsetting to have these beautiful projects marred by a crappy looking edge.

Expand  

practice! and get rid of the 800 grit. I have never used a strop on my leather tools until recently and i'm still out on that. I have always used a piece of 2500 grit sand paper on my granite slab and it works fine. A strop if used wrong will round the edge.  same with the edge bevelers I fold a piece of 2500 grit and polish with that 800 is far to coarse. 

Stroping is for polishing and straightening the microscopic edge and doesnt remove material. sharpening or stone grinding as you call it is creating that edge. Now if your tool has a decent edge angle with no nicks but stroping or polishing with super fine paper wont help then you need to create the microscopic edge again with a very fine Arkansas stone. rough stones are for grinding the necessary angle finer stones create the edge after the angle is cut. 800 grit paper is more like a rough stone so you have went backwards a bit more than likely. 

Edited March 15, 2021 by chuck123wapati

[chuck123wapati]

  On 3/15/2021 at 6:03 PM, sonataworks said:

Could you expand on this a bit more? The tools I bought did not come with instructions, so I'm not sure what "Japanese maintenance" encompasses.

Expand  

you don't need jap water stones to sharpen jap made tools. water stones are excellent and if you can afford them buy them and learn to use them properly or they wont help either but the metal tool simply doesn't know where it was made and japan doesn't make or use steel any different than any other country has access to in their middle of the road tools. 

Edited March 15, 2021 by chuck123wapati

[jcuk]

These maybe of use.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0aApSuDIX4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CH5FmFNNZb4

Agreed 

  On 3/15/2021 at 5:06 PM, Bigfoote said:

strop them every use and then you won't have to sharpen ever.

Expand  

Any cutting tools i use i strop before and after use no matter if it one strap or a hundred straps i have used it on, a good polished edge will make it better in use. If you have the means to make one of these you won't regret it saves a few pounds on fancy stones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiVdwR6vJgg

Hope this helps

JCUK

Edited March 15, 2021 by jcuk

[Danne]

I'm no expert on sharpening, but keep one thing in mind there are no wrong methods if the knife gets sharp.

I use wet and dry from Mirka (There are a lot of good brands, I just have access to that here in a store close)

I have grits from 180 up to 2500 (I also use this for leather edges)

I have no idea what "Japanese tools need Japanese maintenance" means. But at least for my Japanese knives regular wet and dry sandpaper work awesome. I just wet it and put it on my granite plate. If they edge isn't chipped, I start with 1000 grit, and finish with 2500 grit. 

And between sharpening I strop with green chrome oxide. At first I didn't have good results with stropping, but after I lifted the knife a little bit (Like you would when you sharpen a secondary bevel on a knife) just a few strokes make the edge razor sharp again.

What mistake did I do in the beginning?

1. Hesitation when I sharpened, so I practiced on cheap Chinese knives (Like those 2€ knives)

2. When I needed to resharpen a knife I used 2500 grit (correct me if i'm wrong here) but for me it didn't work that great because when I had stropped my knife for a while I round off the edge. And I had to "define" the edge again with 1000 grit.