light duty cylinder arm machine

[MtlBiker]

13 hours ago, RockyAussie said:

I will try and get back to this tonight as it does give a whole lot of advantages to a machine that was only good on heavy gage work mostly.

Well, I look forward to your clarification.  I'm just not sure what "IT" is.  What have you done/changed to make it a game changer?

[Wizcrafts]

2 hours ago, MtlBiker said:

Well, I look forward to your clarification.  I'm just not sure what "IT" is.  What have you done/changed to make it a game changer?

The item that he refers to as a game changer is a narrow throat plate and feed dog. Using these will make a 441 or clone more friendly towards thin work.

Currently, the best way to sew soft or thin material on a cb4500 (etc) machine is to dumb down the machine. Sometimes that includes changing to the slotted throat plate and removing the feed dog. I have done this many times and it takes about 20 minutes altogether. With the newly developed narrow feed set you can sew both thick and thin materials on the one machine.

I have a narrow plate and feed dog set in transit and will report on my findings after putting them through the paces.

[MtlBiker]

39 minutes ago, Wizcrafts said:

The item that he refers to as a game changer is a narrow throat plate and feed dog. Using these will make a 441 or clone more friendly towards thin work.

Currently, the best way to sew soft or thin material on a cb4500 (etc) machine is to dumb down the machine. Sometimes that includes changing to the slotted throat plate and removing the feed dog. I have done this many times and it takes about 20 minutes altogether. With the newly developed narrow feed set you can sew both thick and thin materials on the one machine.

I have a narrow plate and feed dog set in transit and will report on my findings after putting them through the paces.

Thank you!  I'd watched the video twice and still didn't understand what the game changing "it" was.  Maybe I'm the only newbie here who didn't catch on right away, but it would have been helpful if he (or someone) had first outlined the problem/issue and then explained the solution.  This newbie thanks you.

 

[Treesner]

18 hours ago, kgg said:

This comment you receive from Artisan is confusing to me. Trying to sew a patch on a pants leg particularly around the knee area using a cylinder bed is going to be a real chore. I think, a better choice of machine for sewing patches whether on pants or hats, which they didn't directly address, would be a patcher like a Singer 29K or a similar clone.

I think your primary of requirements of hat patches and patching pants is more suited to a patcher machine where you can change the direction of the stitch simply by turning the direction of the the pressor foot. So doing a stitch around a patch is much simpler to do.  You didn't mention which Sailrite machine you have.

Investing in a cylinder machine may not be the overall best / correct machine for your stuff. I still would recommend visiting a dealer with samples of what you want to sew and try a patcher, a cylinder bed and a flatbed machine to see what works best for the majority of your stuff. As the investment is substantial, you and your pocket book would really hate it if you got the wrong machine for your needs.

I took the information from a previous reply from Cowboy Bob in the topic called "Opinions on Cowboy CB6900" I probably misinterpreted his comment " Uwe,to confuse you more,we call it 1341 here in the US ....".

 

patching pants isnt really a primary use case, its just something I would end up using it for. hat patches and patches on products will be really nice on the cylinder opposed too what I have now and I think it should sew my straps well too and be able to get into areas for modifying/prototyping 

[Treesner]

2 hours ago, MtlBiker said:

Thank you!  I'd watched the video twice and still didn't understand what the game changing "it" was.  Maybe I'm the only newbie here who didn't catch on right away, but it would have been helpful if he (or someone) had first outlined the problem/issue and then explained the solution.  This newbie thanks you.

 

its probably one of those things where you need to own a heavy duty machine and try to sew thin stuff on it and fail. he mentions not being able to sew on the edge on his old one. would have been a better video to show him sewing that same material with the old setup to see how it fails 

[Wizcrafts]

20 hours ago, Treesner said:

I'll be sewing patches on hats, patching pants, modifying/prototyping small cordura bags/webbing, 

This changes to equation. There are different machines that are best suited to these jobs. One is the shoe and boot patcher and the other is a post bed machine.

A patcher is a Singer 29 or Adler 30 style machine that has a long tapered arm that resolves down to either 1 inch or 1.25 inches wide at the needle end. The material is pulled by the foot which you can rotate in 360 degrees. If you can fit the work over the arm you can sew round and oval patches, or any shape patch. The foot is controlled by butterfly tabs sticking out the underside of the head. The bobbins in the narrow version are extremely tiny and limited in capacity, while those in the wider nose are simply small in capacity. They are referred to as small or big bobbin patchers.

A post machine has a vertical arm that stands between 6 and 7 inches above the bed. Some have a roller foot, some a flat foot and others have walking feet. Some take a G bobbin, others an M bobbin. Pfaffs take a Pfaff bobbin. I prefer to use a post machine when sewing hats. They do ell on bags too. If you can fold the material out of the way you can sew a patch onto pants knees.

[Treesner]

20 hours ago, Wizcrafts said:

This changes to equation. There are different machines that are best suited to these jobs. One is the shoe and boot patcher and the other is a post bed machine.

A patcher is a Singer 29 or Adler 30 style machine that has a long tapered arm that resolves down to either 1 inch or 1.25 inches wide at the needle end. The material is pulled by the foot which you can rotate in 360 degrees. If you can fit the work over the arm you can sew round and oval patches, or any shape patch. The foot is controlled by butterfly tabs sticking out the underside of the head. The bobbins in the narrow version are extremely tiny and limited in capacity, while those in the wider nose are simply small in capacity. They are referred to as small or big bobbin patchers.

A post machine has a vertical arm that stands between 6 and 7 inches above the bed. Some have a roller foot, some a flat foot and others have walking feet. Some take a G bobbin, others an M bobbin. Pfaffs take a Pfaff bobbin. I prefer to use a post machine when sewing hats. They do ell on bags too. If you can fold the material out of the way you can sew a patch onto pants knees.

yeah I just feel like a 29 or a post style would be to limited, patching pants isnt done a lot just sometimes where a cylinder would be a little nicer. mainly sewing leather, bags, patches on odd shape things so I think a cylinder arm is the most versital for the small shop. I'll get a flat bed machine at some point as well for more of the cordura style work think 

[RockyAussie]

On 10/27/2021 at 7:29 AM, dikman said:

Brian, that is very impressive! What size thread is that? You got more details - price, availability etc? I don't really need one but that's never stopped me before.

HI @dikman, Sorry for late answer mate ...The old computer s..t itself again as it does at times and as usual it was just needing the ram sticks cleaned up. Spent many hours getting a new one and files over blah blah  Still a work in progress. $120au delivered and available in Australia at the moment to you . Just give Jess a call if you want to go ahead. I will do a separate post on these showing some more detail than the video shows. I would do it here but there is a fair bit and I don't want to overload with all the pictures and stuff.

 

On 10/28/2021 at 2:08 AM, MtlBiker said:

Thank you!  I'd watched the video twice and still didn't understand what the game changing "it" was.  Maybe I'm the only newbie here who didn't catch on right away, but it would have been helpful if he (or someone) had first outlined the problem/issue and then explained the solution.  This newbie thanks you.

I understand what you mean and I will do a separate post asap that will give a better and more full explanation of the advantages and once done I will put a link back here.

On 10/27/2021 at 7:29 AM, dikman said:

Brian, that is very impressive! What size thread is that? You got more details - price, availability etc? I don't really need one but that's never stopped me before.

HI @dikman, Sorry for late answer mate ...The old computer s..t itself again as it does at times and as usual it was just needing the ram sticks cleaned up. Spent many hours getting a new one and files over blah blah  Still a work in progress. $120au delivered and available in Australia at the moment to you . Just give Jess a call if you want to go ahead. I will do a separate post on these showing some more detail than the video shows. I would do it here but there is a fair bit and I don't want to overload with all the pictures and stuff.

 

On 10/28/2021 at 2:08 AM, MtlBiker said:

Thank you!  I'd watched the video twice and still didn't understand what the game changing "it" was.  Maybe I'm the only newbie here who didn't catch on right away, but it would have been helpful if he (or someone) had first outlined the problem/issue and then explained the solution.  This newbie thanks you.

I understand what you mean and I will do a separate post asap that will give a better and more full explanation of the advantages and once done I will put a link back here.

 

On 10/28/2021 at 5:02 AM, Treesner said:

its probably one of those things where you need to own a heavy duty machine and try to sew thin stuff on it and fail. he mentions not being able to sew on the edge on his old one. would have been a better video to show him sewing that same material with the old setup to see how it fails 

Too true. My next post will try and convey better just that.

[dikman]

Thanks mate, for $120 I just have to have one!

[Wizcrafts]

2 hours ago, dikman said:

Thanks mate, for $120 I just have to have one!

I used mine today to sew in a zipper in a gaberdine jacket, using #92 thread and a #19 needle. Earlier, I sewed a quarter inch of veg-tan test strip with #277 thread and a #25 needle. I will be starting a new topic about this feed dog and throat plate when I have time to shoot a video.

I think that this topic, originally about light duty cylinder arm sewing machine recommendations, has lost its true north. I think we should refocus on helping the OP find his best machine for his type of work.