Saddle stitching confusion.

[Piko]

So, I have been working with leather for the whole 2 months now. Doing my saddle stitching all happy until I saw the first picture. That is not how I do my saddle stitches i do it like the second picture.  I pass the  thread in my right hand over the left hand thread which essentially create s a weave. Am i doing it wrong?

[tsunkasapa]

I pull the right thread through, and back. Then the left through and pull tight. I think you are over thinking it. Just do it the same every time for consistent stitches.

[Hardrada]

There's more than one way to do it. Which method you choose depends on the final look you want and also on how strong you need the stitches to be.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQK8R0oYT8o

[Klara]

I can't see any pictures, so don't quite know what you are talking about. 

I  learned saddle stitching from Al Stohlman's book "The Art of Handsewing Leather" which I can't recommend highly enough. I'm pretty sure it will answer all your questions, even those you didn't know you had.

 

[JLSleather]

11 hours ago, Hardrada said:

There's more than one way to do it. Which method you choose depends on the final look you want and also on how strong you need the stitches to be.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQK8R0oYT8o

 Not a chance I'm spending half an hour watching some dufus go on about something as simple as sewing with a needle 

SERIOUSLY folks... you want to know how to work with leather?  You have to WORK WITH LEATHER.  Stop spending your day on y-tube (pronounced WHY tube) and ACTUALLY DO IT.  Grasp the idea that you're going to make some mistakes, and jump in.

2 hours ago, Klara said:

I  learned saddle stitching from Al Stohlman's book "The Art of Handsewing Leather" which I can't recommend highly enough.

I love AL's books - probably owned most of them over the years.  But in this one, even Al (who is usually very to the point and informational) got a bit WORDY.  The book ABSOLUTELY IS worth having if you can get it.. just keep in mind that the principle is very simple.

[Tugadude]

There is a lot more to saddle stitching than simply passing the needles through the leather and dragging some thread along for the ride.  There are fine points to it and the results are easy to detect when you know what you are looking at.  Knowing how to get the best aesthetics out of a row of stitching takes trial and error.  Knowing when to use a "cast" or not and even being able to determine which spacing to use, size of thread, etc., all goes into the mix.

 

[chuck123wapati]

1 hour ago, Tugadude said:

There is a lot more to saddle stitching than simply passing the needles through the leather and dragging some thread along for the ride.  There are fine points to it and the results are easy to detect when you know what you are looking at.  Knowing how to get the best aesthetics out of a row of stitching takes trial and error.  Knowing when to use a "cast" or not and even being able to determine which spacing to use, size of thread, etc., all goes into the mix.

 

ok so now please explain how do you do all that? i think that's what he wanted to know. i wouldn't mind either lol.

[Tugadude]

19 minutes ago, chuck123wapati said:

ok so now please explain how do you do all that? i think that's what he wanted to know. i wouldn't mind either lol.

In any endeavor there are people who appreciate things that others simply don't.  How many threads have there been about how to finish the edges of leather projects?  Tons.  And many are happy to leave raw edges, so there's that.  Some describe multi-step processes for their edges which include cutting, edging, sanding, waxing, buffing, sealing and coating, etc., etc.  And others are happy to just apply a bit of water and saddle soap and rub it with some canvas.  

And so stitching is similar in that some take great pains while others don't.

In my case, I floundered around and was able to improve the look of my stitching to where it didn't look hideous, but I still wasn't satisfied.  And then I stumbled upon Nigel Armitage's youtube channel and it changed all of that.  Suddenly I got the idea of what is supposed to happen and more importantly, how to achieve it.  What was once somewhat unpredictable became consistent.  I went from wanting to de-emphasize my stitching to wanting to use contrasting colored thread in order for it to stand out more.  And while the improvement was immediate, I'm still learning and improving.  Every project is different and has specific requirements.  I've also experimented with different stitching irons and found some conducive to certain projects and others not so much.  Same with thread composition and sizing.  

I have a phrase I use that I think encompasses the difficulty in acquiring the various skills and it is "there is no microwave for experience".  Experience is required and it takes time.  Everyone starts somewhere and some take less time to master things but everyone spends time doing it.  And the more you do, the faster the results, assuming you know how to make adjustments along the way.  You also may discover short-cuts which allow for better results with less work.  Work smarter, not harder, etc.

Regarding the comments about youtube, I obviously disagree.  The proof is in the pudding and Nigel's video had a big impact on my ability to execute a proper stitch.  Are there bad videos on youtube?  Of course.  But that doesn't mean they are all useless.  I still watch videos about leather techniques.  Sometimes 99% of the video covers stuff I already know, but it is that other 1% that makes all the difference.  If I pick up one little tip or trick, I consider it worthwhile.

[mike02130]

There is more than one way to saddle stitch.  This is a common method and the one I use.  When first learning I suggest that you pick one method and stick with it in order to avoid confusion.

Flat work such as a wallet. 

Prick through finish side.  Place in pony with finish side on right--the slants will be facing down and towards you. 

Start at far end.

Count two holes forward and back stich (not explained here).  Now you begin coming toward yourself. 

Poke right needle in to open up the hole and to guide the left needle. 

Pull out right needle as left needle enters.  Pull thread a few inches. 

Place right needle below left needle, making a cross.

Pull both sides of the left thread towards yourself (right and left side of the wallet) and insert right needle behind the left thread. 

Pull both threads through horizontally level (this causes less friction) and before the thread tightens, raise left arm up and away from you while placing right arm down and towards yourself while you cinch down the thread.  Think of a cheerleader with pom-poms (keep your mind on the sewing, not the cheerleaders).

Back stich two holes to finish off.

The beginning and ending back stich will now match.

Always be consistent in your movements.

The stitching on the face will be slanted while the stitching on the backside will be straight.  "Casting" will result in both sides having a slant.  

[chuck123wapati]

1 hour ago, Tugadude said:

In any endeavor there are people who appreciate things that others simply don't.  How many threads have there been about how to finish the edges of leather projects?  Tons.  And many are happy to leave raw edges, so there's that.  Some describe multi-step processes for their edges which include cutting, edging, sanding, waxing, buffing, sealing and coating, etc., etc.  And others are happy to just apply a bit of water and saddle soap and rub it with some canvas.  

And so stitching is similar in that some take great pains while others don't.

In my case, I floundered around and was able to improve the look of my stitching to where it didn't look hideous, but I still wasn't satisfied.  And then I stumbled upon Nigel Armitage's youtube channel and it changed all of that.  Suddenly I got the idea of what is supposed to happen and more importantly, how to achieve it.  What was once somewhat unpredictable became consistent.  I went from wanting to de-emphasize my stitching to wanting to use contrasting colored thread in order for it to stand out more.  And while the improvement was immediate, I'm still learning and improving.  Every project is different and has specific requirements.  I've also experimented with different stitching irons and found some conducive to certain projects and others not so much.  Same with thread composition and sizing.  

I have a phrase I use that I think encompasses the difficulty in acquiring the various skills and it is "there is no microwave for experience".  Experience is required and it takes time.  Everyone starts somewhere and some take less time to master things but everyone spends time doing it.  And the more you do, the faster the results, assuming you know how to make adjustments along the way.  You also may discover short-cuts which allow for better results with less work.  Work smarter, not harder, etc.

Regarding the comments about youtube, I obviously disagree.  The proof is in the pudding and Nigel's video had a big impact on my ability to execute a proper stitch.  Are there bad videos on youtube?  Of course.  But that doesn't mean they are all useless.  I still watch videos about leather techniques.  Sometimes 99% of the video covers stuff I already know, but it is that other 1% that makes all the difference.  If I pick up one little tip or trick, I consider it worthwhile.

Please don't think i was trying to be a smart a## with my comment you brought up really good points but said nothing about how to accomplish them.

when do you use a cast?

how do you determine spacing?

how do you determine size of thread?

Me i read and watched then practiced and practiced more its quite easy to stick two needles through a hole but as you said doing it so that it looks good from every aspect, hole size, thread size, corners etc. is the intended outcome i think for anyone.

I just bought new and good diamond chisels which brought up a question when you get to a corner how do you change the direction of the holes so the stitch sits correctly in it? the slits go from one direction to another is that a problem or an overthink?

Edited December 7, 2021 by chuck123wapati