Wizcrafts

Debbie; Sorry for being late to notice this post. I play music on the weekends and don't get to sleep before 3 or 4 am. Your thread must be picking up rust off something along the way, between the thread spool and the needle. Start troubleshooting by unthreading and inspecting the thread itself. If good, move along as follows, inspecting each piece of metal for rust. Check the thread guide on the thread stand Check the top post if you thread through it. Inspect the three hole thread guide before the top tension disks. Unscrew the tension nut and remove the top tension spring, opener and disks. Chances are this is where you'll find rust and maybe even grooving from long term usage. If the disks are okay, run a length of white thread through the check spring assembly (under the top tension disks). If that assembly isn't the cause of the rust, it's better left alone. The next item to inspect is the take-up lever. Run clean thread back and forth and see if it picks up rust (hope not). After that, look at the few thread guides going down, then the last guide on the needle bar. Last, check the needle for a rusty eye! If you find a part that is rusted, and it is easily replaced (e.g., top tension disks or thread guides), replace it. If it is in a difficult location, try using rust remover where it is rusting. If the hole in the take-up lever is the culprit, have a dealer replace it for you, unless you care to undertake a very difficult task.

You have to lower the presser foot bar to get the short foot to hit the leather and cause the inside foot to alternate. The bar needs to come down about 1/8 to 3/16 inch. I created a topic all about this foot set, including a video, under the topic: Inline Cowboy presser feet on Cowboy CB4500

There is another Cowboy dealer a little closer to you. He operates as Neel's Saddlery, in North Lima, Ohio. His days, hours and phone number are on the bottom of each page. The owner's name is Ryan. It looks like you could take I-80 right there.

I recommend that later models of Singer and Adler patchers. I have (and will sell) a long arm, big bobbin Singer 29k172. It has universal feed (as do all patchers), takes up to #138 thread and has an 18 inch long arm with a narrow snout. I also have an Adler 30-7, which is similar, but lifts higher and sews a little thicker. The only real difference between the two machines is that the Adler 30-7 takes a much longer needle system, 332 LLG, than the Singer 29 machines. Also, I was fortunate enough to get the Adler on a power stand, whereas the Singer is on a treadle base. This is a photo of the Singer 29k172 (one of the last model 29k, made in Japan).

Amen! I have taken a drill or strand of round Emory cord to elongate one of the holes on some of my 441 bobbins to get them to fit over the bobbin winder pin. I imagine it is possible that the pin itself could vary in position from the top of the shaft, from brand to brand, or batch to batch.

The first time you get a Western gun belt job, with lots of bullet loops sewn on, you'll appreciate the longer arm on the CB4500. Ditto if you get a job sewing fishtails onto a strap or gun belt.

There are many differences between 441 clones. There are only a handful of top tier brands (see the ads on top of our pages), but lots of lower quality brands (mystery brands on eBay, or Alibaba). For instance, if you bought your bobbins from a company that supplies them to a lower quality 441 brand manufacturer, they might be using hooks that require 30mm bobbins. Or, that brand might use bobbin cases that do not incorporate an ejector spring., which itself takes up room inside the case. Without that spring, the bobbins can be longer and hold a few turns more thread. Those companies won't care if their bobbins don't fit inside a Cobra, Cowboy or Techsew machine. Competition is as competition does!

@carolem I would recommend buying your bobbins from the dealer who sells that machine. I can't imagine why you haven't been doing this all along. You have a Cobra, so why not order bobbins from Leather Machine Company, the owner of that brand? Their bobbins will fit their shuttles, or they will be replaced if a bad one slips through Q.C. If the dealers start getting wrong size bobbins, they will complain to their Chinese suppliers and get them replaced with proper bobbins. As for me, I own a Cowboy CB4500 and I buy bobbins, needles and thread from the dealer who sold the machine to me. If you ordered these oversize bobbins directly from China, contact them about exchanging them. At least let them know that their bobbins don't fit main brand name 441 clones. They may have mistakenly sent bobbins for a different type of hook. Now, I do want to mention that I have acquired a couple of bobbins that were marginally longer than others (maybe 1/2 mm). They just barely protrude past the end of the bobbin case, but the case still closes in the shuttle. These bobbins cause the bobbin thread tension to increase, compared to the bobbins that don't protrude past the edge of the case. You can still use your oversize bobbins if you remove the behive ejection spring inside the bobbin case (not recommended). I would just buy more bobbins from Cobra Steve, or Cowboy Bob.

If the machine is adjusted for its maximum rated alternating foot lift, it should sew up to 3/8 inch of material, occasionally. The largest practical thread size is #138. The tougher the leather, the more pressure you need to apply to the feet to prevent the leather from lifting with the needle. In the same vein, the larger the needle, the higher the foot pressure that is needed. You'll probably max it out using a #23 leather point needle, with #138 bonded thread, at no more than 3/8". Also, 3/8" should not be the regular thickness being sewn. That will wear out the machine before its time. A more practical regular sewn thickness would be between 1/4" and 5/16". The friction will heat up the needle and might melt the thread.

I currently own 3 patchers. Two are Singer model 29. One has a short arm and small bobbin, similar to the 29-4. I use them almost on a daily basis to repair purses, shoe uppers and to sew patches onto Biker's vests and jacket sleeves. That is what they are built to do. I keep #69 thread in the small bobbin machine and #92 in the other two long arm, bigger small bobbin machines. Most patchers are only good for 1/4 inch of leather. The Adler 30-7 and 30-70 can sew up to 3/8 inch. The Claes can sew about 1/2 inch. The 29-4 is so old it came off the Ark! They were built in the late 1890s until the early 1900s.

The pulley was probably meant to be used with a round, 5/16" diameter leather belt

This thread and needle chart should explain it for you.

Before you change to a servo motor, you need to know that this machine is meant to be operated at very high speed in order to distribute the oil from the oil pan to the furthest extremities. It also produces very short stitches. If you intend to sew much slower than its rated 5500 spm, at least get a servo motor than is able to spin up to 4000 rpm, or faster, with the pedal down. You'll want at least a 70mm to 100mm motor pulley, if not larger. Besides the motor's rated top speed, the motor to machine pulley ratio determines the maximum speed. I've seen these machines in garment production shops and the motor pulleys were larger than the balance wheel pulleys on the machines! They were operated at full speed by little old ladies wearing babushkas. This machine needs to be spun fast (well over 2500 spm) after sitting idle. You can do this with the thread out of the needle and the presser foot up. After spinning it at top speed for at least a half minute, you can re-thread the needle and begin slower sewing. There is an oil inspection port covered in glass that will let you know if there is enough oil being distributed. If the machine has been unused for a long time, the oil pan may be low or empty. You will need to buy a quart of Juki Defrix or Lily sewing machine oil and fill the oil pan to the marked height. Clean out any lint or dirt from the oil pickup filter before running the machine for the first time. Also, check the cork seal to make sure that there aren't any cork sections missing, which could allow oil leakage. Use caution if you sew any leather goods with that machine. The longest stitch length is 10 per inch. That could filigree some leather.

Most people who buy the large harness stitchers, known as 441 clones, use them to sew holsters, knife sheathes, saddles, harnesses and saddle bags. They normally come preloaded with #277 bonded nylon thread, on top and in the bobbin and are adjusted and sewn off with this thread (at least they are by our member-dealers), with the test piece under the feet. The most common brands and models discussed on Leatherworker.net include the Cowboy CB4500, the Cobra Class 4, and the Techsew 5100 (they and all other advertisers are supporting us and the server expenses with their paid ad banners). Nowadays, it seems that every leathercrafter who has worn out their hands with hand sewing their goods wants to buy that one sewing machine that does it all. They want it to sew wallet interiors, chaps, knife sheathes, tow straps, harnesses and extra thick gun holsters. I see them posting questions about which machine should I buy (to do all this), or similar wording. Respondents usually point out the fact that the typical upholstery grade walking foot sewing machines cannot sew thick holsters or use heavier thread than medium weight #138. The buyer will have to look at a more substantial machine, like a Cowboy, Cobra or Techsew, etc. Most advice given is to buy more machine than you think you will need. So, the newbie to machine sewing shells out between $2000 to $3000 for a 441 clone (or $6000 for an actual Juki 441) expecting it to sew everything from wallet interiors to hand gun holsters. It sews the holsters just fine, but not the wallets or other thin projects. The knots are too big to hide between the thin leather layers. Pretty soon, they begin posting requests for help getting their (insert brand name and model) 441 super heavy duty stitcher to sew thin stuff. That's when they are told that they need to buy a lesser machine for thin work. Say what? I thought y'all said to buy more machine than I needed! Some folks can and some can't afford to buy a second industrial sewing machine and table for thin work. Their other half (or they themselves) may own a domestic sewing machine, but they found it horrible at feeding and sewing leather, even wallets. They can't justify spending another thousand dollars for a lesser walking foot machine right now. What can they do if all they own is a 441 type machine? In these cases it is possible to "dumb down your machine" to get it to sew thin leather with thinner thread than it was built for. Here's how. I'll use my Cowboy CB4500 as the reference, since that's what I currently own. Let's see how to dumb it down to sew thin stuff with thin thread. First, buy some #19 (or even #20) needles in System 7x3. These are not leather point but are a good fit with #92 thread. There aren't usually any leather points available in System 794 under size 23/160. This is both a matter of economics and the tendency of these extra long needles to bend too easily below size 23/160. Also buy #92 bonded nylon thread in the colors you intend to use (two spools of each color - one for the bobbin and one for the top thread). I usually get bobbins, oil, needles and thread from the dealer who sold me my machine. Order some extra bobbins if all of yours are already loaded with thick thread. Install a #19 or 20 needle (with the scarf facing to the right). Any other size will be either too tight or too loose for this thread. Thread the top with #92 bonded thread, but don't loop it around the top post. Feed it through just one hole. The extra tension from wrapping the thread around two holes in the top post could make it impossible to sink the knots effectively! Wind an empty bobbin with the color of #92 thread to be used on the bottom of the wallets or interiors, or chaps, etc. The bobbin spring will be way too loose if the last bobbin had #207 or larger thread in it. so, tighten it down to get a decent amount of tension of the bobbin thread, but not so much that the thin leather puckers on the bottom. Note: you may have to first loosen the long bobbin tension locking screw before the tensioning screw can be turned. Set the stitch length to about 6 or 7 stitches per inch. Run a test stitch line on a stack of the same thickness of leather/material as the interior, or whatever you are going to sew. Back off the top tension adjuster until the knots move down. You may also have to back off the bottom tension thumb nut so the bottom roller turns with the thread wrapped around it. If the knots still won't drop between the layers, you'll need to loosen the tension on the check spring. This spring is normally set to high tension action to work with the much heavier #277 or #346 thread that the machine was built to handle. Loosening the check spring action requires one of the open ended metric wrenches (11 or 12 mm?) that came with your CB4500 to loosen the nut on the back of the left end of the head, where the check spring shaft is fastened. This is a tricky tight fit and may require dinking with the position of the wrench to loosen that nut. With the locking nut backed off a thread or two, use a screwdriver blade on the front side to turn the bottom roller/check spring shaft counterclockwise until the spring loses some of its tension. Find a position where the spring travels all the way up and just makes it all the way down to the bottom travel stopper, then tighten down the locking nut. The check spring should have enough range of motion to hold the top thread taut until the needle has fully penetrated the leather. Sew some test stitches again. If the knots are still too close to the top surface, either back off the top tensioner all the way, or tighten the bobbin spring a little more, until they are submerged between the layers. Make sure that your top thread is feeding freely to the top tension disks! These are the basic steps needed to dumb down a big Cowboy, Cobra, Techsew, Juki 441, or any other brand name 441 clone. It is possible, even after you do all these steps, that the huge needle hole in the feed dog and oversize rectangular slot in the standard throat plate may let the thin or soft leather get pushed down inside the plate, or the feed dog itself. This might ruin your work, or cause gathering and tiny stitches. There is a solution though. If your machine came with an accessory flat throat plate with a narrow slot, you can remove the standard plate and feed dog and instead, use just the slotted plate. It is much less likely to allow the leather to be pushed into it. However, since you are taking the bottom feed dog out of the equation, your stitch length will change and reverse stitches may not hit the same holes unless you play with the stitch length lever as you sew backwards. If you didn't get this plate with the machine, you can order one from the dealer who sells that brand and model (to avoid possibly mismatched mounting holes). I have done this temporary conversion many times, and it is always a PITA. Whenever possible, I use a different machine that is already setup with #69 or #92 thread and has shorter needles that don't deflect as easily. Dumbing down your 441 machine to sew thin projects may earn you enough money to buy a proper upholstery grade walking foot sewing machine (the type that maxes out at 3/8" and #138 thread). Having more than one machine will greatly expand your sewing possibilities.

The CB4500 is built for sewing thick leather with heavy thread. However, you can dumb it down for the occasional light leather sewing job. I have posted the steps previously in one or two replies over the years. Search the leather sewing machines forum for the term "dumbing down." The process takes about 15 or 20 minutes and requires the use of round point #19 needles and #92 bonded thread, plus extra bobbins for this thread.

If you notice the member's user name is Shoepatcher and find it curious, it is because his entire business is about rebuilding/restoring machines that are used to sew shoe uppers. These are all patcher machines of many makes and models. I promise you that Glenn knows his stuff.

Thanks, "Shoes," but I am good for now. I got all the 332LLG and 332-LLG-LL I need from both Bob Kovar and "Shoe Patcher." 332 LLG are considerably longer than the common 332 and 29 series needles.

Yes, you are a member. You can advertise your machine for free in the Market Place section of the forum. There's a sub-forum there for used sewing machines. Don't advertise it in this section. Make sure that you include pictures and your asking price, as well as if you want people to contact you using our messages system, or by email. If by email, please obfuscate the email address so it doesn't get scraped by email harvester bots.

What are you referring to when you say control panel? Are you referring to the internal electronics, or the external on/off switch box? Or, perchance, to a positioner?

What kinds of shoes do you make, @Vinculus?

That looks like a nice wide mouth folder. How much thickness could one feed through it?

I am guessing that the first part of your question is referring to the Family Sew motors. If so, yes, there is something about the way the control lever is fastened to the shaft that controls the speed that makes the motor begin to slow down as you push hard on the pedal to speed up. It might be twisting or deflecting the speed controller inside the case when the chain from the floor pedal is on an angle. I found that I had to rig a large C clamp to the pedestal base to make the chain line up below the control lever to negate this effect. For some reason, some of these motors favor a direct vertical axis pull to achieve the full range of control. Could be the case, or the bearing moving. I dunno. It is only the top speed that is affected by the off-axis pull on the chain. Slow speeds are awesome and I can easily keep the CB4500 sewing at 1 stitch every 4 seconds, if I need to. In fact, when I set the speed dial all the way to the slowest setting, I can floor the pedal and it will sew at about 1 stitch per second. I set it there whenever I sew fishtails onto belts and straps. Answer to part two. Yes, the first brushless (push button) motor did make a slight rattling sound under certain loads and speeds. The last unit was pretty quiet though. I believe it was more powerful. But, it suffered from a sharp ramp up from off to slow. That's why I installed a gradient light beam filter that I got from Steve (as per a YouTube tutorial someone posted). The filter gave the motor really nice slow speed startup control. Unfortunately, there was a slight hiccup at a certain point that I never got rid of. I learned to feather past that dead spot. My current Family Sew motors don't have this problem. I hope this helps.

I have had both types of servo motor on various sewing machines. When I first got my CB4500, it had a push button, brushless servo motor installed. That motor quit without warning after one week of owning it. I received a free replacement, which was a slightly newer version of the same design. I had to create a custom varying density light filter to get smooth slow speed control. It lasted about 2 years, then it croaked. I replaced that motor with a rotary switch controlled Family Sew F?-550s, with a very small pulley, in late 2014 or early 2015, and it has performed flawlessly ever since. The brushes still work fine. It came with an extra set of brushes and a spare cork brake for when they are eventually needed. One of the foibles of the push button servo motors was the way you changed parameters by pushing so many times on the up and down arrows. You literally had to cycle past unwanted options to get to the startup and top speed controls. One of those push button options was to reverse the direction the motor spun, as I found out the hard way! No more push button servos for me!

There is a chance that the bobbins and needles for the ancient Pearson/BUSM harness stitchers might fit your Bauer stitcher.

As regards spare parts, good luck. If fortune smiles on you, you may find that it uses similar bobbins to some other machine from the 20th Century for which parts are still available. These could possibly be from a (Campbell) Randall Lockstitch, or a Landis 3 or 16, all of which use boat shuttles with cylindrical bobbins. Other parts may be made of unobtanium and would need to be custom made.