Wizcrafts

HCM; Are you aware that you can raise the needle bar and use the longer Pfaff system 190 needles in the Nakajima 380? I use those needles in my National walking foot machine and it gained an additional 1/8 inch sewing capacity. It does involve re-timing the machine, as you raise the bar to position the longer needle's eye to the pick-up point.

Use that combination as decorative stitching or for layers that don't expect to be under a lot of stress. The locked stitches are only as strong as the weakest thread (138). I wouldn't use that 277/138 thread combination on mission critical projects (e.g. Police gear, competition shooting gear, weight lifters' belts)..

Timing check, 101: I suspect that the bunched up thread around the bobbin has thrown the timing off. The rotating shuttle is screwed onto its shaft with two machine screws. They have probably lost their good grip by the jammed thread. Clear out all thread from the bobbin area. Remove the throat cover plate, then rotate the wheel by hand until the needle goes all the way down, then starts to ascend. The rotating pickup point should pass dead center on the right side of the needle's scarf area, about 1/8inch, or slightly more above the actual eye. If the point passes the scarf and eye after the eye of the needle is above it, you need to loosen the shuttle retaing screws and back it up until it passes inside the scarf, above the eye. Do the reverse if the needle is too far back from the ascending needle. It is also possible that the needle bar has moved vertically, but not as likely as the shuttle itself. If you do find the shuttle needs timed, be sure to tighten down its screws as much as possible, by hand.

I had a Singer 111w155 for a while, years ago. It came with a few spools of #138 thread which it handled flawlessly. I have no doubt that you can push it up a notch to #207 thread. But, the bobbins are the smaller standard class 15 size and they won't hold much #207 thread. So, if we agree on #138 thread, top and bottom, you would stock up on #22 and #23 needles. Leather point needles, type 135x16, work better that regular round point (135x15) when sewing leather. Some leather point needles produce a zig-zag stitch pattern. If you find that objectionable, buy triangle point needles only. If you want to experiment with #207 thread, buy a pack of #24 needles. Also, buy a dozen bobbins. Don't forget Lily Oil. When you sew with thick thread and a big needle (#23 and up), you place a lot of stress on the machine to hold down the leather as the needle and thread (with the locked stitches) ascends. To compensate, turn the top pressure spring clockwise, to exert more pressure on the feet. Wide, double toe presser feet are better able to hold down leather under such stress than single or narrow feet.

I would say that your particular machine has reached its capacity, at 15 mm, with that thread and needle combination. I sent you a PM with some detailed things to do to verify that the timing is set to the best position. Note, that the timing changes as the stitch length changes. If the machine is set to sew perfectly at 6 stitches per inch and you move the lever down to sew 4 to the inch, the timing may be out. This gets even more critical in reverse. Let me convert math... 6 spi = ~4+ mm stitches. 4 spi =~6+ mm stitches. Maybe there is too much wear in the combined feed mechanism? Is the needle bar tight? Is the feed dog tight? Is the inside foot coming down at the right moment to hold the leather in place just as the needle beings to penetrate it? Does the inner foot move exactly in concert with the needle and feed dog?

Here's a photo of the trailing uni-pod "outer" foot set.

I like that idea about chamfering the top of the needle slot in the feed dog, even when used with the stock throat plate. My friend at M&M Leather ran into a problem where the stock feed dog and throat plate had too much width for some of the jobs to be sewn (they were falling into the slot). So, he had a friend in a machine shop grind down the sides of the feed dog, to just clear the hole and had a new throat plate made to just clear the feeder. The plate's slot was also shortened to match the actual travel of the feeder, at the longest stitch length. This alleviated the trouble that first cropped up when using the Cobra to sew garment leather belts, chap straps or very narrow straps for things like purses. The narrow feeder still moves the bigger projects, so it was a win-win to create the narrow set. For those moving into 441 Sewing 201, if you install one of the feed dogless throat plates, your stitch length will decrease. You can alleviate the drag somewhat by backing off the top foot pressure adjuster, over the presser foot bar.. You may still need to move the stitch lever down a bit to regain the previous stitch length. Be careful to not back off the pressure so far that the leather lifts as the needle pulls out of it!

I wish I had one of those miniature milling machines. I would take other people's holster and stirrup plates and mill off steel from the bottom to allow the feed dog to remain in place. As things are now, one must remove the feeder to install the slotted and raised throat plates. On a new machine, you might need to employ the Green Giant to loosen the big screw that secures the feeder.

Doug; I don't know what you are referring to as if that was a lot of information. I only typed 4167 characters, encompassing just 752 words. Shouldn't take ya more than a minute to read it all! Some of my security blog posts are double that amount of characters and words.

There are a few types of (new) machines that will sew both bags and holsters. These are all cylinder arm machines, not flat beds. I'll list the common models below. It's up to you to determine how to afford any of them. CB2500 / GA5-1 with or without reverse. These machines have a 10.5" arm length, large bobbins and big needles and can sew with #346 bonded nylon, or 5 cord linen thread. They are limited to no more than 7/16 inch of leather under the solid foot. Drive is performed by a feed dog on the bottom (with teeth). The marks can be rubbed out with a spoon, or modeling spoon, or slicker. 227R type machine, like the CB227R or Techsew 2700. These are alos 10.5 inch arm machines, but not as heavy duty as the above machines. They do, however, have triple feed and interchangeable presser feet and all manner of accessories that can be bolted onto the top plate. Limited to #138 or 207 thread, they can sew 3/8 inch of leather, or anything else. 441 clones (of the Juki 441) are cylinder arm machines with triple feed and a smooth feed dog. Most sold here are equipped with what we call a harness foot set. This consists of a double toed outside foot, with no metal in the center, and an inside foot that moves with the needle, to feed the material. These machines have arm lengths of 9, 16.5 and 25 inches. They all take up to $145 bonded, or 6 cord linen thread, have huge bobbins and can sew about 7/8 inch of material. We have dealers on this forum who specialize in setting up and selling/maintaining these 441 type machines. Top brands include Cowboy, Cobra and Techsew. Also, there are similar machines sold by Artisan, Ferdco and Weaver Leather. Boss hand operated portable stitcher. This machine is driven by your right arm pulling and pushing on a big lever on the right end of the machine. It has a limited depth inside of only about 6 inches or so. It does use big needles and can sew up to 3/4 inch, with $346 thread, or heavier. The machine needs to be bolted onto a work table. It is okay for prototyping jobs and sewing close to to the outside edge of thick straps or holsters. It is not so good if you need to rotate a large piece of leather towards the inside, such as when sewing up, around and down a holster. It may not fit inside the body, or bend up enough against the body to allow the return row of stitching. Your arm will get tired quickly if you use it to sew a long stitch run. As for pricing, the GA5/CB2500 types generally sell for about $99 without and $1300/1400 with reverse. They come with a special cutout industrial table, and a servo motor. The 227 type machines are typically about $1500 - $1600 and usually come on a pedestal type movable table. The 441 clones usually start at about $1800 - $1900, for a 9" arm, $2100 - $2500 for 16.5" arms (depending on accessories), to about $3000 for the 25" models. The Boss manual stitchers sell for $1400 new. Used, they usually go for about $700 to $800, or so. If you cannot afford any of these machines, look for or inquire about a used 227 type or a Singer 153, with walking feet. These typically sell for about $400 to $700, depending on the dealer and condition of the machine and the table/motor sold with it. All machines must be shipped by truck, so if you can't go to a dealer's location, be prepared to spend another 2 to 3 hundred for shipping on a pallet. Since you have no previous experience with industrial or any sewing machines, I would advise against buying from Craigslist, or the run of the mill eBay sellers. You are going to run into problems until you learn the ins and outs of setting up and maintaining/troubleshooting your machine. Ebay dealers may not offer any support, or limited email support. Phone support may only be for returns under warranty (if any). Most used machines are sold with a very limited warranty, if any. If you buy a used machine, try to get it from one of our member dealers, like Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines, Keystone Sewing, Techsew, (I suspect that Cobra Steve has some used machines)

Yes, a piping foot is the same as a welting foot. Piping is sometimes the inside cord and sometimes the finished round product. You can buy premade cloth, leather and vinyl piping, or make it yourself with rope or piping cord. There are four types of piping/welting presser feet. Standard piping foot cut-off back piping foot double piping foot double cut-off piping foot The standard foot or feet have a channel going all the way from the front to the back of the left side of the outer (walking foot) or single (straight stitch) foot. If walking foot, the inner foot also has a channel or arc cut into it, although it is rather short. The cut-off style uses the same inside foot (for walking feet), but, the back is ground off and radiused to allow the foot to turn sharp corners. Upholsterers often turn a sharp corner on covers and replacement coverings. A standard welting foot pushes the material into a straight line and fights the operator around hard curves. The double channel piping sets are used to lay down two rows at the same time, of the same size piping. This is a decorative effect used by upholsterers. Zipper walking feet have one toe: right or left, plus a narrower than usual inside foot. Straight stitch zipper feet are either movable left to right, or pre-made for sewing on the left or right edge. The single feet have a wide flat profile, with a cutout for the needle. You can literally sew right up the the side of the raised edges of any kind of project with a flat zipper foot. Unfortunately, the same does not apply to walking foot sets. The inside foot occupies at least 3/16" width, placing the needle about 1/16" away from the edge being sewn. I do have one very narrow left toe set that gets very close to the raised area, which is on its right side. In the brave new world of the 441 clone machine, the presser foot design is nothing like the usual walking or flat foot machines. The standard feet that ship with the machines from China are a very wide set, with aggressive teeth on the bottom. They have a matching feed dog, with similar teeth on it. This set is known as a blanket foot set. It is used to provide flawless traction for sewing blankets, buffing wheels, tarps, awnings, parachutes, etc. Most leather workers don't want to have tooth marks on either side of the leather, so, the dealers contract to have a smooth top feed dog made and what are known a harness feet. These feet have no steel in the rear middle area. They have a single left, or right toe, or a combination double toe configuration. The double toe is now shipped to the end customer as standard equipment. The dealers remove the blanket feet and the feed dog with the teeth and replace them with a harness foot set and smooth feed dog. There are very few optional presser feet for the 441 clones. Were that they were Adler 205 clones, which some of the Cowboy machines are, then one could buy optional Adler feet for special uses. A single toe Adler foot has steel in the rear middle section. Some jobs are better sewn without any steel in the middle, others benefit from the extra support provided by rear-middle steel on the work. Don't forget, these machines are triple feed and have a moving inside foot. One type of outer foot that is experimental is a single-center toe, behind the inside foot. This is either cut from an unwanted blanket foot, or made in a metal shop. Such a foot would only provide support to the leather behind the inner foot, to the rear of it's maximum travel. It would allow one to sew handcuff type cases with a narrow stitching flange, right side up. It could also be used to repair stitches on shoe out-soles. I think that most dealers have a grinder, sander and buffer that could create such a uni-pod rear foot from a blanket foot. Bob Kovar made one and a picture of it is on his webpages for the CB3500, 4500 and 5500 machines. Go to, say, the CB4500 page, find the underlined link for "See more photos of our optional pressor feet and throat plates for the CB3500, 4500 and 5500 models."and click on it to reveal a slideshow along the bottom of the page. One of the feet is the uni-pod set. It was experimental.

Doug; I'm sure there are dozens of sewing machine videos on YouTube, many of which show a welting foot in action. With the proper arch (size) welting set you can lay a stitch line right along the side of the raised portion, which contains the cord. The material is formed around the cord and flattened at the bottom, by the feet. You can use a single toe outside foot to sew close to the round edge of piped material. But, you'll never get as close as you can with a welting foot set, of the proper width. Upholsters usually have two or more walking foot machines. One is setup with a standard double toe foot. The other is typically setup with a 1/4" welting foot set. If they need a different size of piping, they swap out the feet for the desired size. I have a very narrow zipper foot set, only 1/4" total width, but it has teeth on both feet. It is great for sewing in zippers! Most walking foot feet are smooth bottomed. There are only a few types that have teeth. Those are zipper and binding feet. Edge binding, running through a 90 degree side-feed edge binder/bias tape attachment, benefits from the added traction provided by teeth on the feet. Bob Kovar stocks most walking foot sets. Call him (866-362-7397) and tell him what size cording you need to sew and how thick the covering material is going to be. The size of the foot set is determined by the overall thickness/diameter of the covered cord/material around it.

I think you meant to say the left toe foot, which is away from the edge guide, on the left side of the inside presser foot. The right toe foot sticks out about 1/8" to the right of the inside foot and will interfere with the edge guide, if the guide is set very close to the strap or project being sewn. I almost never use the right outside foot. The left toe foot has one toe, on the left of the needle and inside foot. The right foot has one toe to the right of the inside foot. If this foot is used, you will have to stitch about 1/4' inside the outer edge. With the left toe foot you can get a 1/8" in stitch line, while using the roller guide.

Email response time on AOL depends on who you send your email through. I have had delays up to one week in delivery of email sent to Bob, or other AOLers. At other times the email was never delivered at all, not even to a junk folder. They apply their own blocklists and have their own definition of what constitutes spam. Rather than let members decide, AOL's mail servers make a decision first. If they get it wrong, and they do, the email in question is held up, or rejected, with no notice to the intended recipient, or the sender. In fact, the only notices I have ever seen from AOL, are for an unknown account (misspelled), or a full account not able to receive any more messages.

I have had to repair very old rifle cases and golf bags for collectors, or people restoring items from the parents or Grand Parents. These items were sewn on Puritan chainstitch machines, using 6 cord waxed linen thread. Some of these items were over 60 years old. The stitches were fine; the leather need patching! My Union Lockstitch machine likes 4 through 6 cord left twist linen thread. But, after buying a bargain brand once, I recommend only buying Barbour's Irish Linen Thread. It costs more, but it's well worth the money.

It could be that the top thread is binding on the way to the needle. Bob Kovar made a video showing , but it is the same for most of the other 441 clone machines. If you thread your new machine the same way, your knots should be in a better location, everything else being equal.

The Cobra is brown; the Cowboy is beige. The Cowboy presser feet and throat plates are cut from stainless steel. Both machines have the same specs and are well made and serviced by the most competent mechanics in the business. The official Cobra and Cowboy dealers stand behind the machines they sell. Price-wise, if similarly equipped, they cost about the same. The Cowboy machines are offered a la carte, at a lower price, for those who don't want or need all the accessories, and are usually in stock all the time.

135x15 has a standard round sharp point that is used to sew everything made from cloth. 135x16 has a narrow twisted chisel point and is used to sew leather. The only ways you will get a smooth cover plate is if a dealer happens to have one in a drawer of new-old parts, or if you get one machined. Ditto for the feed dog.

The needles in system 135x15 and 135x16 go up to #25, which will sew #207, top and bottom. The maximum thickness with these needles, on a stock setup, is 3/8 of an inch. You may be able to bump that up by reducing the lift of the alternating feet and possibly grinding down the top of the outside foot. This may allow you to sew 7/16 inch. Sewing at full capacity or above will wear out the machine in a short time. To be safe, use a #22 or #23 needle with #138 thread, top and bottom, and limit the thickness to just under 3/8 inch. The machine will last longer this way, if you keep it well oiled.

All industrial sewing machine dealers have these needles. They are the most commonly used system in garment sewing machines and post machines. They are also known as system DBx1, 16x257, 16X257LR, DBXF2, 1738LR Lower the needle all the way down. Use a flashlight or movable lamp to observe the needlebar and look just above the removable puece that secures the needle. Better yet, unscrew the needle holder completely from the bar. You should see a paddle shaped spring along the thread path, ending just above where the needle holder mounts. The paddle piece provides tension to the thread as the loops are being formed and in between stitches. If this spring has broken off at the paddle, you will have skipped stitches and other problems with sewing. I had a bent paddle spring on my patcher when I first got it and bought a replacement with two tiny screws, for very little cost, from Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines. I can't imagine it would be very expensive to have a spring, a pair of screws, a pair of tension disks and a few packs of 1738LR needles mailed to you. You can find their contact details on their website.

This fact tells me that the machine is meant to sew thin, soft leather, with thin thread. It is the perfect machine for doing decorative stitching on boots. It is a great machine for sewing shoe uppers, moccasins, caps and hats. As for belts, maybe dress belts, no thicker than 3 mm, using T-70/B69 bonded nylon thread. The #18/110 needles are perfect for #69 bonded thread. The 134R needles are for sewing cloth, not leather. You should stock up on leather point 134-LR needles for sewing leather projects. Schmetz are about the best needles you can buy.

The Cowboy CB2500 uses a needle system that begins with number 22/140, which is suitable for #138 bonded thread. The Boss uses system 794 needle which begin with a #19/120, suitable for #92 thread. Both use a similar shuttle and bobbin. As for punching power, the Boss relies on your right arm to punch through the material, stitch after stitch. The Cowboy gives that task to a powerful motor. The CB2500 has feed dog drive a static presser foot, but has an optional big roller foot if needed. The Boss has needle feed, with a jump foot. The CB2500 has a 10.5" area between the body and needlebar. The Boss has a bit over 6 inches inside clearance. The Boss has an aluminum casing and some gears are aluminum. The CB2500 uses steel gears and has an iron case. Magnets stick to it. The Boss is portable, if there is a bench to bolt it to. The CB2500 is not portable. Both machines can handle #346 thread. Needles are available in both systems.

Loops under the leather tell that either the bobbin pressure spring is too tight, or the top tension is too loose, or the needle is in wrong, or the wrong length, or the foot lift mechanism is disengaging the top tension disks prematurely. Follow the top thread from the spool to the head. Make sure it actually feeds around the little stud behind the top tension disks, then around and through the disks from right to left, then through the little twisted metal eye, then up to the take-up lever, down the hole, past the little spring above the needle and into the needle's eye, from left to right. Examine the action of the foot lifter mechanism and see if it is moving the tension disks apart, with the hand lift lever down. If so, move the adjuster (puck or sliding cam) to lower the foot lift a tish. You want to make sure you have enough lift to clear your leather, to feed new stitches, not so much that the disks get separated as you sew. I had an old patcher that didn't like 29x needles. The thread kept getting dragged under the shuttle. So, I tried using type 1738 industrial needles and they sewed just fine. You want the bobbin pressure just tight enough to provide a little resistance. The top gets more tension. If the needle is way too big you might get loops on the bottom. Finally, make sure that the spring on the take-up lever is properly tightened.

How much thickness of leather do you intend to sew? What size thread will you be using the most? What are your primary sewing projects going to be? Things to keep in mind are one of the two machines you mentioned is a production quality machine and the other is more of a prototyping machine.

Linen thread predates both nylon and polyester thread. It was used to sew parachutes, awnings, sails, shoes, saddles, holsters, golf bags, briefcases, rifle cases, luggage, etc. The most famous brand of linen thread is Barbour's Irish Linen Thread. Formerly made in Ireland, the company was dismembered and its assets sold to Coats and Clark. Barbour's linen thread is glazed with a light weight coating that holds the twisted strands together. It is produced in standard left and custom right twist and is sold in one pound spools. While it is possible to use linen thread on a modern sewing machine, it is not really that strong unless you run it through a wax pot on the way to the needle. The wax solidifies inside the leather after a while. This permanently locks each stitch in place. Waxed linen thread is rot resistant and is able to remain functional even if one or more bottom stitches are worn down, as in the soles of shoes. Almost every hand sewn leather project is done using waxed linen thread. 6 cord waxed linen thread is incredibly strong and long lasting. It is difficult to sew waxed linen with a regular industrial sewing machine. Not impossible, just difficult. The wax clogs the guides and tensioners and the eye of the needle. It must be sewn at very slow speeds, with a larger needle than otherwise would be used.Six cord waxed linen thread would probably need a #28 or #30 needle to feed it and form a loop. Needles that big are not available for normal industrial machines. Only the biggest harness or shoe stitchers have needles that big. If you want to sew regularly with waxed linen thread, you should get a Union Lockstitch or Campbell stitcher, both of which use barbed needles and stabbing awls. If chain stitching is acceptable for your work (bottom stitches not visible), a Puritan machine will do nicely, at a lower cost than the ULS or Campbells. They have wax pots for liquid wax and accept huge, barbed needles, and use awls.