rktaylor

Thanks for the tips. I printed a couple from Word to try. I don't remember the fonts, but they looked good on paper. However they weren't easy to carve. I'll try some others. Randy

Ron, Your swell cover looks good. I know that was one area you wanted to improve and you sure accomplished the goal. I like your tooling as well. You have a good style. I have struggled with the ear cuts. I finally got them cut right (at least good enough) the first time on my current saddle. Good luck with the seat. I know it is stressful. Randy

Andy, My suggestion would be to build them one at a time. Preferably yours first, so you will have more experience when you build your lady's. I was building my second and third simultaneously and ended up really only working on one at a time. If you are full time leatherworker it makes sense to be working on two at a time, but not for us hobbyists. It will be a rewarding journey. Enjoy, Randy

I don't have a set of alphabet stamps and need to put a name on a dog collar. The letters will be 5/8 to 3/4 inches (16-19 mm). I was going to print the name, then trace and carve it. Any suggestions on a font that would be easy to carve and look good. Thanks, Randy

I just put down my Stohlman volume 2 and then looked at your saddle and had to look again. Nice work. It looks like you took your time. The swell lacing and edges look good. Randy

I apologize for the confusing questions, but I am back on track. I believe it all comes back to assembly order and the fact that I am mixing methods from multiple sources (Watt, Adams, and Stohlman). I am looking for my groove, but I am a long ways from answering questions. Thanks for helping me learn. Randy

I watched part of the JW DVD this morning. Though he doesn't mention it specifically, he does oil the part of the skirts that contact the bars before he installs them. Randy

Ron, If you think I am confusing you, you should see me. Ha. My first saddle basically followed Dusty Johnson's plan. The second was the in-skirt rigging and I was making up a lot on the go. It was easy to oil everything because the skirts/rigging went on last. Jeremiah Watt installs skirts before the back of the rigging so the tugs are under the rigging. He doesn't mention oiling until late in the process. I have followed enough of his steps up to now, it's kind of hard to change. I think I am going to oil the parts of the skirts that aren't visible before I install them and then oil the visible parts when I do the rest of the saddle. I am hoping to find a 'system' that works for me, but I don't know if I will ever build enough saddles to accomplish that. However, since I have been numbering my saddles with two digits (I didn't figure I would ever need three), my daughter pointed out that if I don't build 10 I wasted the first digit. Thanks for taking the time to reply. I appreciate the advice. Randy

Thanks for the feedback. I am not sure what I was thinking about installing the skirts ahead of the swell cover. I hope to get the swell cover installed before the weekend so I can start thinking about the seat. I need to look over someone's shoulder for a while. I need the skirts in place before I fit my seat. Do you install the skirts temporarily to fit the seat and then wait until the seat is fit for final installation? If so, do you pull the rear lugs over the top of the rigging plate (flat plate rigging)? My educational material says they go on under the plates. I am probably mixing methods from several makers. I don't know if that's good or bad, I am just trying to find my way. Thanks, Randy

I am almost done with my skirts and have my riggings installed. I am wondering if I should oil my skirts before installation. I won't be able to get to most of them after they are installed. If I do, should I oil everything I have made to this point? I am also thinking that I should cover my swells before installing skirts. Thanks in advance for the advice. Randy

Thanks for the tips. I will get some band aids and charge ahead. Randy

I volunteered to replace the fleece on a friend's saddle. Actually I got some round bales out of the deal, but now I might take them back. Somebody ran the saddle strings all the way through which I can redo without repeating. However the pockets for the tree bars are sew through the fleece as well. Furthermore, the pockets are part of the rigging and go under the swell cover. I am pretty sure I can remove it all and sew the pockets back on before the fleece is installed. But then I would have to realign the riggings. So, should I: 1. Do this the easiest (fix it like it is now) but probably not correct method? 2. Remove the skirts and riggings and fix it like it should be? 3. Return the saddle as is along with the hay? (not really an option, but it crossed my mind) Thanks, Randy

Billy, This thread kind of took on it's own life, but the discussion has been great for me. Thanks for all the thoughts. Randy

Ron, I took the one photo of my saddle directly from the side so that you could see the rise in the ground seat. I got that from another thread on marketing saddles. The other angle that is helpful is looking straight down. Then you can see the leg cut outs. I am learning a lot about ground seats. You know my second saddle thread turned into a ground seat discussion. It was really beneficial for me. The saddle is looking good. I am going to work on rigging plates tonight and maybe my skirts some. Good luck on the spring deadline. It will be here before you know it. Randy

Thanks Billy. I am locked on the metal strainer for now. If I ever get to a 4th saddle, I am leaning toward all leather. Randy

Big Sioux, Thanks for the compliments. Those aren't the 50th welts, but they aren't the first either. They're just the first ones I kept. The skirts were modeled after the saddle this is intended to replace (reference comment to Bob above about what to copy). They don't look too out of balance to me, but I can see your point. I think they actually may have ended up a little shallower in the rear after I blocked them. The skirts on the reference saddle are not blocked. I see what you are talking about on the back of the skirts. I think the rear of the skirts gets straight too soon and the straight edge is to long. I hear Jeremiah Watt echoing in my ear, "There are no straight lines on a round skirt saddle." I'll do better on the Will James. You are right, there is a lot of educational material available. Some is really good, some is ok and some not so good. I have a little of all three categories. What I use most are the Stohlman books, Watt DVD, Harry Adams' book, and this forum (in no particular order). Try to stay warm up in SD. Randy

Bob, I have thought about getting a good profile gauge and modeling a good seat. I guess since you did it that just means is was another good idea that I didn't act on. When I look at most of the saddles in my tack room, I am reminded of a statement from Stohlman's book regarding using poor saddles to learn construction. Basically, you can't learn how to make a good saddle, if all you do is look at poorly constructed saddles. I have a friend who recently purchased a really nice saddle. I may profile the seat on it. Take care, Randy

Ron, I appreciate you mentioning it, because the ground seat is the sculpted part of the saddle. The Cary Schwarz DVD I mentioned is called "The Ground Seat" and is produced by the Traditional Cowboy Arts Association. I think it's $45 on Amazon. I patched a triangular piece of leather in my Will James over the weekend to move the low point on the seat forward. I don't think it's as far forward as it should be, but it's a lot better. I am starting to see the triangle bicycle seat that is often mentioned. I would like to go to Prescott, but it's not in the budget this year. Thanks again, Randy

Ron, Thanks for the comments. I used Blevins buckles, but like you say we are talking ounces at this point. But take a few ounces out and pretty soon you are at a pound. I delayed my reply because I have been looking at a lot of seats since you posted. I am thinking about buying Cary Schwarz's DVD on ground seats. Anyway, I think (and the key word is think) I get it. I do believe I have placed the rider a further back than I should have. I don't think it's too steep for the way it's formed, but if I moved the rider forward it probably would be. I also think I need some improvement near the cantle points (as well as many other places). The saddle feels pretty comfortable on the stand. When it warms up a bit, I'll cinch it on a horse and see how the wife likes it. I am getting back to work on my Will James today and am really taking a hard look at my ground seat, before I start working on my riggings. Thanks again for making me think and study. It's good for the mind. Randy

Thanks Tramp. I know nothing about V-Twins so maybe we're even there. Nice catch CW. I saw that after posting the photos. I am not planning to have a billet, so it's even more important to get it burnished. Randy

Ron, It is probably hard to judge from photos, but if you put this one and the first side by side any sane person would pick this one. It's definitely a learning process and I still have a long way to go, but it's been a fun journey so far. Bob, I think it would be tough to get another half pound out of it and still have a decent saddle. I chose the Mother Hubbard style skirts/rigging because I thought it would be lighter. Given another chance, I would use rear jockeys. I think they would make the back look cleaner and be easier to build. Oltoot, I knew you were going to comment on the rivets and I don't doubt you for a second. In my defense, they aren't domed too much. I just tried to curl the edges some, so there is still a fairly flat surface. It may be a weak argument, but with the projected use and my young wife's age those rivets will be someone else's problem. I did plug around (probably 1.5" or so) and inside the rigging hardware, so that should wear fine. Thanks for all the comments. When it warms up some I will cinch it on a horse. Randy

Well, I just finished my second saddle. It's on a 14.5" Bowden BWBR tree that finished at about 13.74". It has 13" swells and a 4x13 cantle. It's mostly 10-11 oz. Hermann Oak with some heavier skirting in places. It weighs in at 28.75 lbs with no cinch. As I posted earlier, I wanted the saddle to be as light as possible (spouse request). It's about 6 lbs heavier than the saddle she currently uses, but there just isn't much in that saddle. I believe it was Bob Brenner who said 28 lbs was about the lightest I could get without scrimping on methods and material. I wanted to do something different with this saddle (relative to the first) so I could learn. The in-skirt rigging was fun, but a bit of a challenge for a novice like me in that I didn't have any educational material to study. I think it's pretty solid and I like the way it went together. The Cheyenne Roll and welts on the fork were also something new to me (really everything is new to me). I would say that there are very few pieces on this saddle that were the first attempt. Thanks to everyone who provided advice along the way. It was extremely important to me even if I didn't use it. Now I need to get back on the Will James I am building for me. Then I would like to build another one of these so I can fix some of my mistakes. Someday, I would like to build one with a master looking over my shoulder shaking his/her head. These are the Glamour Shots. Comments, suggestions, and scathing critiques are welcomed. If you would like a close up of a certain area let me know. I have some less glamorous pictures that I may post in Saddle Construction to point out what I think went wrong to cause them. Randy

I am certainly no expert, but I would get a tree that he can grow into. As you know it's a lot of work and you don't want to do it every couple of years. Do you think you could make the stirrup leathers and fenders to fit him now and then change them when he out grows them? I am interested to see what you decide to do. Randy

It's looking good Ron. I should have one finished in a week or so. I will post some photos in the gallery when I finish it. Randy

I think that looks pretty good. It's not world class, but neither is mine. I plan to spend a lot of time in 2015 just working on floral patterns. It's just time in the saddle. I wonder if it's better to carve the same pattern multiple times to track success or move on. There's a lot of different ways to draw all the components and each seems to require different tooling. Carve another one. Randy