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@chuck123wapati If you insist on being a grumpus each time you are awake at 4.00a.m. why unload on this forum? Go outside and yell and stomp around a bit. It will decrease tensions until your coffee is ready and will not be offensive to anyone. Now back to the topic of the lovely candle-holders. @Sheilajeanne thank you for clarifying that it was someone you knew whose table was damaged by tealights, but you know about it and warned about it. That was nice. @Heartless You are perfectly right, about making different sizes as well about the care to take. Different sizes in complementary colors are going to look stunning!

@fredk yes those are really nice and convenient. I use them too. But I also need real candles for other reasons. And @chuck123wapati nothing silly about wanting to be safe and people are talking about personal experiences; not conjecture. If @Sheilajeanne's table burned, it is possible others have faced that as well and just been more careful about it from then on, without making a big issue about it, like Sheila Jeanne did not until this subject came up and she mentioned it, which is so nice of her. I, for one, rather hear about possible dangers than have people say " I should have told you' after I face a problem. I'm sure you feel the same. Leather gloves are used by welders and blacksmiths usually cowhide which are believed to be able to withstand temperatures of up to 500 degrees C and of course, resist sparks and electric currents. Elk is good as well, I believe. So leather is probably fire resistant and as long as we make our holders of cow leather or elk and don't let the wax run down the side and catch fire (does it do that?), we should be fine. Now I think that is enough from me on matters other than the lovely candle holders. Will make them as soon as I make some Halloween things for my daughter! Those, and the candle holders are exciting projects and short ones too. @Gezzer, I will put up photographs if I manage to make them reasonably well. If I don't put them up, you can take it to mean that I messed them up.

@Sheilajeanne, I did not think of that! None of mine have ever burnt down. Usually they burn down about halfway in the center and then refuse to stay lighted in the liquid wax, so I throw them away, or rather, store the wax for my wax punch surfaces. My glass holders are from Ikea. I use their unscented candles. I have no idea what will happen if the entire candle burns down though. They are plain transparent glass, which is why I want to make these lovely leather holders. I think I will let one candle burn down in its glass holder and see what happens. I do not want to damage a leather holder that I take the pains to make.

@Sheilajeanne thank you for that warning. I do not normally use tea lights and this is a further reason not to do so, since I always forget them until they die out. I plan to make these holders a little bigger for the small glass candle holders which I normally use and which are very plain. I always collect small bowls everywhere I go and place my candles in them. I need them, forgetful that I am.

I was just telling my husband how touched I was that @Gezzer took the trouble to give such clear instructions to make the beautiful candle holder he designed and made. We talked about how nice people are, in general, in this forum and my husband said something very significant. To quote: "If people form an opinion about the world on the basis of the nature of the people in this forum, they are in for a rude shock when they interact with the world outside." So true! I feel blessed that I found this forum!

@Gezzer thank you! Your explanation is very clear. Can't wait to make this!

@Gezzer maybe you could include a slight rim around the edge so that if the candle is lifted, the melted wax will not overflow onto someone's hands? I love this pattern though. Do you think you could share the pattern?

You could try using a non-oily conditioner first. I think chemical guys conditioner is one such - being water based, it might restore some of the moisture. Follow it up with something like neatsfoot oil or anything that will retain moisture. Not sure this will work but could be worth a try.

I vote for the leather strap.

@Gump I found the pattern pack. Thank you for directing me there and sorry about the very delayed response.

Yes, mine have curled up a little too, all of them. Will see what happens over the days.

That's really nice. I like the colors.

Oops! if orange oil does NOT show damage, I will use it undiluted, else diluted with mineral oil.

I do not know about the Vergez Blanchard but I have a Henckel and that works well for me - I use leather up to 6oz. so no idea how it would work for heavier leather. Frankly, I increasingly only use a Stanley knife and a round knife for most cutting these days, using the scissors only for the odd corner that might not be completely detached. Using a scissors, I find, does not give me as smooth a cut line as a knife does but that might just be that I am not cutting correctly with the scissors..

Welcome to the forum. This is exactly how I felt as well, when I discovered this forum.

You will need much longer than a week to learn enough about tanning to actually do it yourself, unless you get a person to actually guide you through the process.

@fredk I like the idea of the different numbers of holes. I will do the same. I think you have covered everything. I am using 5 oz leather, cut into 3 inch squares. Also using coconut oil instead of Sesame seed oil. I want to check if the rancid smell disappears or can be masked. So I am testing 4 oils - neatsfoot oil, mink oil, coconut oil and mineral oil. Planning to also check the effects of orange oil - I have the food grade variety and use it for all my cleaning. Very effective. Want to know its effects on leather as well. I will use it undiluted on one piece and if it does show damage in a week, since it is a solvent, I will use it undiluted, else will dilute it with mineral oil. I applied the oils with a kitchen paper towel. 1/4 tsp was just about right for the 3X3 inch pieces. The control pieces are all with my rolls of leather, in the house - temp controlled, humidity controlled, at least relatively. The ones in the car that I use regularly, I am keeping in an open box, exposed to light and darkness, heat and cold, car movement. And whatever else there is in the car! Outside, they are also kept in a box, on paper towels, exposed to the elements. In the garage, they are kept in a flat layer in an open box. I keep all my information on my computer in an Excel spreadsheet.

@TomE Thank you! That is a lot of information.

@chuck123wapati yes of course that is true. But then, that is why some chefs' food is much preferred over that of others. And of course tannins are not the only thing that affect the quality of leather! Not rocket science either to know that! It could be one of the things that affect quality though, along with other things. My question is just whether the quantity of tannins affects the quality of the leather or not. What @TomEstated above suggests that depth and extent of bonding may differ as well. So this might be a more complex answer than I expected! TomE's articles and the earlier one sent by @ArkieNewbie could provide that answer.

@TomE Could you please post them? I would love to read about it.

@Littlef Actually, I did not seal the leather before dyeing it with vinegaroon. I cleaned it with saddle soap like I usually do and no, repeated treatment with vinegaroon did not help. I tried that as well. I do apply neatsfoot oil oil after the dye, always. It does darken of course, but I cannot depend on it. These were always trials on scraps of leather, which I always do before I actually dye the piece I am working on, so I could adjust accordingly. @chuck123wapati I absolutely agree about it not being rocket science. I can read the process up but my question is about whether the quantity of tannins differs in good quality and average quality lather. @ArkieNewbie thank you for that. I will read the article. When working with leather, there is so much time to think that all sorts of questions come up!

To explain my question, A while ago I dyed a piece of leather with Vinegaroon. It only turned grey. Research suggested that the Vinegaroon was depleted. So I made a fresh batch and the leather turned black as expected. Fast forward a couple of months and again, another piece of leather turned grey. Fresh Vinegaroon and it still remained grey. Further research said that this happened because there were not sufficient tannins in the leather. Dipped the leather in strong tea, dried it and then used Vinegaroon, it turned black. However, because I used the tea, color transfer did happen. Now, I know to use a sealant if I need to use tea when dyeing with Vinegaroon. The question is, evidently the leather I used in the 2nd incident had lower tannins. Does that in any way reflect the quality of the leather? Do better quality leathers have more tannins or less or is it unrelated to the quality of leather? I have been wondering about it and thought I would put it up here.

Not quite sure why Iron sulphate in water is used. Plain white vinegar with any old iron added gives a gorgeous black color. It takes a few days, no more than 3-4 days, but the results are always wonderful. My first batch I used old, rusted iron nails and that worked fine. Now I use steel wool and that works well too. I have been using vinageroon for a while now and after a dip in vingaroon I just rinse my leather in running water and let it dry. That is really sufficient I find. It does not stink either - a very mild smell that disappears in a couple of days. I am always concerned about the pH going too high if I dip in a baking soda solution, no matter how dilute. Vinegar is anyway 5% acetic acid in water, so it just gets rinsed off with a quick wash and since water has a more or less neutral pH, it balances out the pH perfectly well. A little vinegar remaining would, in fact, maintain the ideal pH of between 4 and 5. The vinegar is also too dilute to damage the threads used, if rinsed off immediately after a dip. Some things really are simple, surprisingly so. But that is nice!

A bit late in this thread but here goes. @Doc Reaper I agree with you. A few weeks ago, I went to one of the Tandy classes to learn how to attach grommets. The person demonstrating insisted that the snaps they sold were the only ones available anywhere and anything else did not exist! " I don't know where you got those from! I have never seen them ANYWHERE" was his specific reply when I asked if he knew where I could get the more delicate snaps I use and that are better for smaller items like coin wallets. Most salespeople always give some information or just say they don't know. The ones I got from Tandy earlier are just lying to one side, unused. The ones I got from Amazon are better and they are surely made in China. Wonder where the ones from Tandy are made! If the salespeople are ready to listen and then convey what customers say to their management, it might make them aware about the defects in their products. This attitude.. Hmm. it really put me off. Luckily, the very exuberant manager is toned down now and very approachable. I don't go to that store now unless I know she is present. @Sefuller about the snaps, perhaps you could order a smaller number to check that they suit your purpose and are of good quality as well. I do that for everything now.

Back. Got everything ready with mineral oil, neatsfoot oil and mink oil; not sesame seed oil yet. Will do that soon. Also trying to determine what oils are used these days to process oil-tanned leather. I know it used to be fish oils and some probably use it still, while others use synthetic compounds, my research suggests. Spoke to people where I get my oil-tans from - Springfield leather - Angela has to contact the supplier for that specific information. Very helpful people at Springfield leather and it is Kevin from Springfield leather who confirmed that fish oils are used in oil-tanning treatment. Once I know more, I will decide if it is worth while adding oil tanned to my list of leathers to treat with the oils.