Why are so few small/mid sized items lined?

[chuck123wapati]

i think its pretty much just what the person making the decision wants to make.no matter if filling a niche market or saving money on production.

When i design a product i make it like i want it i can add the cost of liners or not but maybe I don't want it lined just that simple IMO.

[chuck123wapati]

4 hours ago, chiefjason said:

 

Don't compete with cheap stuff.  Don't compete for cheap customers. 

I'm not the best at that but I price my stuff based on my time, experience, quality, etc.  Usually, if anyone takes the time to compare you can see the differences you are paying for.  I'm not going to give my time away.  I sell some of my simpler and cheaper stuff on ebay.  Occasionally someone tries to make an offer if I forget to remove that option.  I always turn them down.  They always get mad and don't order.  But I'm not accepting a low ball bid where I break even.  

Some customers you probably don't want.  It's not a popular opinion but over the years I've developed a sense for it.  And it usually involves trying to haggle down my price or asking for lots of options I'm not offering.  

I don't think you get the choice of who to compete with anymore so i price stuff as i see fit. Just yesterday i saw on my wifes FB page leather cc holsters popping up for about 20 bucks each because i searched them. I cant compete with them at all. Its plain however we now also compete with an algorithm, hundreds in fact, that uses in most cases fake bots and fake likes on social media to push its implied sales and quality.

[JLSleather]

$90 for THAT?@!

Amazing the things people will throw their money away on.  That's like $5 worth of leather and a few minutes labor.  Click it out like 10 per minute, a little cement to hold it for a minute while it's sewn.... ughhh...!!!!!

But, not my problem what the other guy does with HIS money, I suppose.

I like LINED myself.  There IS something to line with, ALL the time, in various thickness / stiffness / style to suit anything.  NO LEGIT reason NOT to line a project... usually always about COST (the MAKER'S profit, not actual cost).  Everybody wants to "maximize profit" and some can't see that lined DOES.

[dans79]

17 hours ago, mike02130 said:

  I read some shop's About sections and many describe their dissatisfaction in the corporate or I.T. world.  They start an Etsy shop, do social media and then open a Shopify site.  They lack the skills to make a quality product and lack the pride of doing excellent work.  They judge themselves by their "likes" on social media and their income.  Quality is not a barometer for their work.

I was trained as a physicist who specialized in software, and I have worked most of my professional career as a developer, And I love what I do. Imo, the number one issue with most of the people who get disillusioned with tech/IT, is that they shouldn't have been here in the first place. Some of them got sucked in by the allure of a well paying job. A lot of others I have known thought, it would be cool, because it's an office job with lots of down time, and a flexible schedule. However, Almost every single one of them had the same underlying issue, they don't want to learn new things, and they don't want to solve new problems every day. 

IMO, the out of hand social media stuff, and general lack of caring about anything, is a sign of poor parenting. I was raised to take pride in my work, whatever it is, and I Generally don't care what most people think one way or the other, as i was raised to know my worth and have self respect. I'm the type of guy who generally says we are either going to do it right, or we aren't going to do it at all.        

 

11 hours ago, Bert03241 said:

its sad when you have 3 hrs of labor 2 to 3$ of materials $4.50 in postage plus ebay fee's on an item that should sell for 35 to 40 $ but you sell it for 24 because of all the cheap crap others are selling  and I end up making 12 bucks. Who in their right mind works for 3 bucks an hour?We do just because we love making this stuff.

One of my other hobbies is woodworking, and knowing your worth is a topic that's routinely brought up in the community. Doesn't matter if you're a hobbyist who does a commission piece every year or two or a self employed bushiness owner. If you're cheap people who know you will always expect you to be on the cheaper side, and you will never get out from underneath the stigma. I've seen videos, and they usually offer a seminar or who at woodworking shows to go over the details, as they are talking about more than your time and the cost of the materials.      

 

3 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

I don't think you get the choice of who to compete with anymore so i price stuff as i see fit. Just yesterday i saw on my wifes FB page leather cc holsters popping up for about 20 bucks each because i searched them. I cant compete with them at all. Its plain however we now also compete with an algorithm, hundreds in fact, that uses in most cases fake bots and fake likes on social media to push its implied sales and quality.

Imo, The internet is a benefit or a hindrance depending on who you are. Back in the day if you wanted to sell something, you had to do it locally unless you where a large company who could afford regional or national level advertising. Thus, if you were in a saturated market you where going to have a real hard time staying in business.

Today anyone can set up an Instagram account to promote themselves, and an etsy or shopify account to sell their products to anyone anywhere in the world. The down side is that you need to be able to stand out from the crowed. You need to be able to promote yourself via social media with quality videos and photos, and you need the same for your website/store. Sadly I see a lot of people fall flat on their face in this regard, as they think having a website is all they need. Barry Kings website for example is atrocious. If you go looking for a Maul you will find tiny images and no details other then the diameter of the head and the weight. If you want to know how long the handle is, what it or the head are made out of you need to start googling. People reselling his products aren't any better either.


Imo, leather craft is also an industry where the customer needs to be educated to an extent, but very few people are doing it. If I started a leather goods company tomorrow I'd probably have some products that have multiple versions. Hand stitched and machine stitched, lined and unlined, normal and premium leather etc. But i would also have a place where potential customers could learn what those terms mean and what the benefits of one vs the other are.

I saw a very nice portfolio the other day on etsy, but the marketing was terrible. It had a few small pictures, and the description was something like hand made from full grain vegetable tanned shoulder leather. The first thing that came to mind, was your average person has no idea what any of that means, and they aren't going to spend the time to look it up.           

 


 

   

[Klara]

15 hours ago, JLSleather said:

$90 for THAT?@!

But you get the pen and the notebook with the cover! (actually, that's about $ 13.60, phew...)

Personally, I don't mind lack of lining, actually, it never occurred to me to line my checkbook cover etc. But I make them, I don't buy or sell them. 

Regarding the general situation, I think @mike02130 has nailed it.

 

[Spyros]

I didn't understand it either until I started making bags.  When you make bags you buy sides, a side will make you 2 bags if you're lucky, and then you end up with a whole bunch of offcuts that are too big to throw away and too small to make a bag with.  And now I have a pile of offcuts the size of a small island.

I reckon those hastily made small items, that's what it is, someone getting rid of this offcuts.  I have to do it too at some point, just design something cute and simple and make 100 of it as fast as possible.  Will I line them?  No.  Why?  Because I make bags, I don't want to waste time on something that is not my specialty.  I just want to get rid of offcuts as fast as possible and if I make a buck in the process then so much the better.

[Spyros]

If I make a notebook for myself or my wife I will handstitch it, line it, paint the edges, sand them to perfection and make them shine.  I just struggle to believe anyone would actually pay me fairly for that labour.

[Handstitched]

1 hour ago, Spyros said:

I just want to get rid of offcuts as fast as possible and if I make a buck in the process then so much the better.

I second that .  I make simple  ' one piece ' knife cases from belt off cuts and scraps , suitable for 'leatherman' type folding knives with ' expandable' gussets to fit an assortment of knives etc.  (I 'll post a pic later, happy to share.  )  I make belts mostly, and custom  h/d  molded knife cases  thats my ' bread & butter' .  The off cuts are too short for a dog collar ,  a bit too heavy for cat collars, and over kill for a book mark, they sometimes get cut up for  belt keepers or used for repairs etc.  , but I always end up with assorted off-cut lengths, not much good  for anything else. But I don't line any of my  knife cases or phone cases. Only my hand bags. 

HS

[fredk]

7 hours ago, Spyros said:

. . .   And now I have a pile of offcuts the size of a small island.

. . .  I have to do it too at some point, just design something cute and simple and make 100 of it as fast as possible. 

. . .  I just want to get rid of offcuts as fast as possible and if I make a buck in the process then so much the better.

Take your offcuts, cut them into two-finger sized pieces, doesn't matter what shape or colour or actual size, punch a hole and thread on to a cheap-ish* split ring. Even glue two odd shaped pieces together, doesn't matter that shapes don't match, even better that the two bits are different colours, thread on to a cheap* split ring. If you do shows or markets, throw these into a basket for $1 each.

People like the 'one-offs' and odd gewgaws to hang from their bags or phones

*cheap as in not expensive but of decent quality, can be bought 100 for just few a $$

Takes up little time to make, can be done whilst watching TV or a home based DVD movie. Almost more profit in these gewgaws than in regular skill made bags and such

[dans79]

10 hours ago, Spyros said:

If I make a notebook for myself or my wife I will handstitch it, line it, paint the edges, sand them to perfection and make them shine.  I just struggle to believe anyone would actually pay me fairly for that labour.

I got into leathercraft just so I could make a folio (i guess is the best word for it), because i couldn't find anything of the quality or style I wanted even up to the $1k range.