Laser engraving / cutting of leather

[Dwight]

Kinda thinking about "maybe" getting into laser engraving of leather.

Then maybe stepping up to laser cutting out of parts.

Would definitely appreciate any first hand good news on both.

Thanks, may God bless,

Dwight

[KYCat]

Following--- been thinking the same thing.

A lot of this is Greek to me and any pointers will be appreciated!

 

[PastorBob]

I have the luxury of "borrowing" a Glowforge.  It can do awesome engraving, but has issues cutting 4-5 oz or thicker leather.  There are better solutions for cutting, just don't know what the best is for both.

[LatigoAmigo]

13 hours ago, Dwight said:

Kinda thinking about "maybe" getting into laser engraving of leather.

Then maybe stepping up to laser cutting out of parts.

Would definitely appreciate any first hand good news on both.

I have software experience, so I saw the laser as an opportunity to produce perfect edges and hole alignment.

At first I rented a laser at a maker-space. The 100 watt Epilog did a very fine job of engraving, but with a purchase price of $35,000, it was somewhat out of my range. I picked up a 100 watt CO2 laser for $4,500, but the trade-off is that the engraving on my machine is not very refined, so I do very little of it. As far as cutting, it does a great job, but on some heavier leathers I might have to "go over it" a few times to get it to cut all the way through. The trick that I learned is that because the focal point of the laser is what does the cutting and because the leather does not always want to lay flat, using a light adhesive, I glue what I'm cutting to a sheet of stiff "oil board" or "stencil board" that's available from a local art supply store. Then I use weights and /or tape to hold the oil board flat. I must add that I am cutting mostly somewhat stiff heavier leather in the 4-5-6 oz. range. Also, I not only cut out the pieces, I also cut in the lacing holes, as I only hand-sew my bags.

The biggest headache I've had is aligning the laser beam. I replaced the laser tube, all the mirrors and the lens, and it took quite a few tries to get the beam back into play. If the laser is not aligned correctly it will not cut as expected. If you do get a laser and end up needing align the beam, here is a site that you might found helpful. 

https://smokeandmirrors.store/pages/laser-beam-alignment-guide

With the laser, I can cut patterns that are almost impossible with a knife, and the edges are cut perfectly (albeit soot covered). The trade-off with laser-cutting the lacing holes is that they are soot-filled, so I can only use dark thread. 

Although there are a few trade-offs, I sure hope that is the good news you were looking for, I wouldn't be doing leather if not for my laser. Here is one of my recent bags.

[Lobo]

About 12 or 13 years ago I hooked up with a shop providing laser engraving services. All run from a computer program, basically any image that can be scanned into memory can be replicated in any scale.

My focus as a holster maker was offering the option of military and law enforcement images, such as military unit crests, badges, etc. Customers could send me a photo or other image via email, have it replicated on the new holster. The shop doing the laser work was willing to take these on as a one-of-a-kind job for a quite reasonable fee, and the turn-around time was only days.

In a year's time I think we did about 5 total orders. Wasn't worth the time dealing with customer questions and putzing around with the details (photos, links to images, endless questions).

Market demand did not justify the time this little idea ate from my daily schedule.

Your experience may be different.

[Dwight]

LatigoAmigo . . . and Lobo . . . 

Thanks for your information . . . I was also looking at "prices" and was swallowing hard after I saw some of them.

And I know there will not be a large market for the services . . . like Lobo mentioned . . . but I do have one call . . . one project . . . and kicked it around a bit to see if I wanted to go further into it.  

Since I very seldom cut anything at all as thin as 4/5 oz . . . even the cutting idea looks like a bust.

But again . . . thanks for the information . . . 

May God bless,

Dwight

[Garyak]

4 hours ago, LatigoAmigo said:

I have software experience, so I saw the laser as an opportunity to produce perfect edges and hole alignment.

At first I rented a laser at a maker-space. The 100 watt Epilog did a very fine job of engraving, but with a purchase price of $35,000, it was somewhat out of my range. I picked up a 100 watt CO2 laser for $4,500, but the trade-off is that the engraving on my machine is not very refined, so I do very little of it. As far as cutting, it does a great job, but on some heavier leathers I might have to "go over it" a few times to get it to cut all the way through. The trick that I learned is that because the focal point of the laser is what does the cutting and because the leather does not always want to lay flat, using a light adhesive, I glue what I'm cutting to a sheet of stiff "oil board" or "stencil board" that's available from a local art supply store. Then I use weights and /or tape to hold the oil board flat. I must add that I am cutting mostly somewhat stiff heavier leather in the 4-5-6 oz. range. Also, I not only cut out the pieces, I also cut in the lacing holes, as I only hand-sew my bags.

The biggest headache I've had is aligning the laser beam. I replaced the laser tube, all the mirrors and the lens, and it took quite a few tries to get the beam back into play. If the laser is not aligned correctly it will not cut as expected. If you do get a laser and end up needing align the beam, here is a site that you might found helpful. 

https://smokeandmirrors.store/pages/laser-beam-alignment-guide

With the laser, I can cut patterns that are almost impossible with a knife, and the edges are cut perfectly (albeit soot covered). The trade-off with laser-cutting the lacing holes is that they are soot-filled, so I can only use dark thread. 

Although there are a few trade-offs, I sure hope that is the good news you were looking for, I wouldn't be doing leather if not for my laser. Here is one of my recent bags.

I bought a Brother scan and cut SDX 230 to mess around with and got to thinking about digitizing the lifetime of Tandy’s patterns that were passed down to me and that led to cutting leather on it. Heavier than it says, and heavier than you should sometimes, but why not. It will cut 6 Oz bag side leather all day. I’ve never used the a laser, but I know it runs on the same Kinda Software. My brother I’m limited to 24 inches wide, but I can run endless length cuts, engraving, filigree, embossing, just about everything more than I knew it could do. I got 3 grand in it, but that was for cutting vinyl stickers, I forgot about stickers. I accidentally discovered the best thing I didn’t know I needed. Had to learn from the floor up. Absolutely not one second of any computer skills beyond an Atari 5200 video game. Once I got it, I got it. I imagine a laser could do finer work and probably last longer. I’ve made this thing make some weird sounds shoving veg tan in it. 

[Double Daddy]

I have toyed with this idea for a while...not so much for gun leather items but more for accessories and knick-nack goods (coasters, valets, journals, etc). I live in a somewhat "tourist-y" area where these kind of things are popular. My full-time day job consists of mostly CAD work so the design technology isn't a big leap for me, learning curve-wise. My brother, a fairly talented woodworker, just added a laser engraver to his tool fleet for engraving his smaller items (cutting boards, charcuterie serving trays, game sets, etc)...we've been playing around with leather to see how it works and the results have been pleasing enough that I'm going to have him do some initialing for me on a couple of upcoming commissioned graduation gifts.

[Bert03241]

First off never ever buy a glowforge

OK Now and 80 watt Chinese laser like a Rabbit USA , a Boss Or Thunder will cut 7 to 8 oz veg tan leather no problem. Also it will do very nice engravings. I have a 60 watt co2 laser and it does all I ask of it, altho sometimes I have to make a second pass on 8oz veg. I cut and engrave all my knife sheaths and gun holsters and wallets on my laser.When hand stitching I leave about a foot of thread over the needle this give two strands of thread going thru the hole for the first foot and this cleans out most of the char. another thing I do sometimes is make the holes smaller then us a 1/16 dremel drill and then there is no char to dirty the thread. Also I oil and dye my leather  then give it 2 coats of sheen before I cut out the Pat. This makes it very easy to clean of the soot with a damp rag. You can buy a 60 to 80 watt laser well under 10 K anything more then 80 watts and you loose engraving sharpness . Its hard to dial down the power for fine engraving , so  80 watts is max I'd get  I like my 60 watts does it all pretty good.

[PastorBob]

5 hours ago, Bert03241 said:

First off never ever buy a glowforge

what didn't you like about it?  When was the last time you used one?  They have made upgrades.  Not saying I would buy one either, they are pricey...I just have the luxury of borrowing one.

[jrdunn]

On 5/10/2022 at 12:49 AM, Garyak said:

I bought a Brother scan and cut SDX 230 to mess around with and got to thinking about digitizing the lifetime of Tandy’s patterns that were passed down to me and that led to cutting leather on it. Heavier than it says, and heavier than you should sometimes, but why not. It will cut 6 Oz bag side leather all day. I’ve never used the a laser, but I know it runs on the same Kinda Software. My brother I’m limited to 24 inches wide, but I can run endless length cuts, engraving, filigree, embossing, just about everything more than I knew it could do. I got 3 grand in it, but that was for cutting vinyl stickers, I forgot about stickers. I accidentally discovered the best thing I didn’t know I needed. Had to learn from the floor up. Absolutely not one second of any computer skills beyond an Atari 5200 video game. Once I got it, I got it. I imagine a laser could do finer work and probably last longer. I’ve made this thing make some weird sounds shoving veg tan in it. 

@Garyak, I'm interested.  Any tips on what to get (or don't bother with) regarding the Brother?

Jim

[Garyak]

4 hours ago, jrdunn said:

@Garyak, I'm interested.  Any tips on what to get (or don't bother with) regarding the Brother?

Jim

Unless you want Disney stuff, don’t get the Disney edition. I don’t care about Disney, so I spent hundreds extra to get stuff I’ll never use. Make sure you get one that operates the roll feeder, just buy the kits to unlock what you need. I told the salesman how much I wanted to spend, big mistake. I went in blind with no reference. He sold me everything and extra everything, just cause I had a budget. Outta 3500$ to spend, I owe 600$. Got some nice heat presses. All of them…. Anyway, I’m sure you can handle it, but the brother isn’t push and play. I’ve heard others are kinda simple compared to the brother. Find another owner to swap ideas with. I wish I did. Must have! Scanning Mats! Low tack-standard tack, long and short. Cutting mats the same. You’ll like it. 

Edited May 11, 2022 by Garyak

[Bert03241]

15 hours ago, PastorBob said:

what didn't you like about it?  When was the last time you used one?  They have made upgrades.  Not saying I would buy one either, they are pricey...I just have the luxury of borrowing one.

1. Its way over Priced, you can get a much better machine for less money.

2. Its cloud based you need internet to use it. WHAT!!!! who ever thought of this had a screw loose.

3. They tell you you have to use their preferred materials which are way over priced and totally BS. you an use regular materials just like real laser use.

4. Their slow

5. They lie to you about their power ratings. They say their pro version which coswt close to 7K is 45 watts which is not true. its closer to 30 watts nominal out put

6. Their cooling system sucks, they tend to over heat and stop so you have to wait for them to cool down.

7. Their made of plastic and if theirs a fire( and lasers do catch fire) they burn your house down. Most real lasers have metal cases which have a better chance of containing the fire.

8. There's no Z axis

I could go on but you get the idea

[Ferg]

I have an Omtech 60W CO2 laser. 500mm x 700mm usage area. I haven't done leather but most everything else.

My machine cost $2700 delivered inside my shop. It was set up perfectly. I leveled it on my shop floor, installed exhaust system, turned it on and 

have never looked back. Have never had to adjust the mirrors or anything else for that matter. I am making jigsaw puzzles now.

You need a lot of research time spent on everything and none of it on a leather forum. Access Lightburn Forum and find everything you need to know

and then some. Learning curve? You bet your "sweet bippy". Anything worth doing requires work and lots of trials and error. Every material you try with a laser will require

some resetting of speed and power. What you see as a result will blow your mind when you do your first good rendering of "Laser Engraving" on wood.

[Gulrok]

150 W Laser here. 

I laser cut belts at this point in my business.

Some others have good experiences. I've been able to dial in the 'char' to the point that there is no soot leftover when I pull a belt off the laser bed. You're able to wipe your hard along the edge and have a clean hand afterwords.

I replaced the mirrors with higher quality mirrors. The laser head was replaced as well. 

[RockyAussie]

6 hours ago, Gulrok said:

150 W Laser here. 

I laser cut belts at this point in my business.

Some others have good experiences. I've been able to dial in the 'char' to the point that there is no soot leftover when I pull a belt off the laser bed. You're able to wipe your hard along the edge and have a clean hand afterwords.

I replaced the mirrors with higher quality mirrors. The laser head was replaced as well. 

That for sure would be a dream to see. What thickness and type of leather may I ask? Do you top seal the leather first?

[Ferg]

I am convinced that most any absorbent material such as wood or leather would/does laser better and relieve the operator of 

way too may hours of cleaning when the product is sealed and has a finish coat on it. My jigsaw puzzles prove that to me.

My lasers, I have a 3W Diode laser also, provides some fantastic product. The possibilities are only diminished by your imagination.

Ferg

[Gulrok]

14 hours ago, RockyAussie said:

That for sure would be a dream to see. What thickness and type of leather may I ask? Do you top seal the leather first?

I'll get a video for you. I have belts to cut out.

At the moment I'm cross hatch patterning some leather for a wallet... because why not?

[Gulrok]

15 hours ago, RockyAussie said:

That for sure would be a dream to see. What thickness and type of leather may I ask? Do you top seal the leather first?

 

Hey Rocky. Its 12/14 oz English Bridle from RJF leather. No top seal.

Edited May 25, 2022 by Gulrok

[Gulrok]

2 hours ago, Ferg said:

I am convinced that most any absorbent material such as wood or leather would/does laser better and relieve the operator of 

way too may hours of cleaning when the product is sealed and has a finish coat on it. My jigsaw puzzles prove that to me.

My lasers, I have a 3W Diode laser also, provides some fantastic product. The possibilities are only diminished by your imagination.

Ferg

 I would have to disagree. See the video I just posted. 

I have personally found that inexperienced laser operators tend to have struggles when dealing with materials. I run test cards when I get new leather (a 6"x6") on the leather. I then pick the best settings from my test card. Depends on what thickness I cut - but I usually use my 4" lens on any belt leather. I have my laser dialed in to be able to cut 3/4" plywood without problems.

I cut 1/2" plywood boxes all the time. You can wipe your hand along the edges without soot. 

Yes the edges have char - but it goes away with burnishing and my normal edge dying process. 

[Bert03241]

On 5/24/2022 at 2:31 PM, Gulrok said:

150 W Laser here. 

I laser cut belts at this point in my business.

Some others have good experiences. I've been able to dial in the 'char' to the point that there is no soot leftover when I pull a belt off the laser bed. You're able to wipe your hard along the edge and have a clean hand afterwords.

I replaced the mirrors with higher quality mirrors. The laser head was replaced as well. 

I really cant believe you can wipe your hand down it and come out clean, thats just not possible

[Gulrok]

Just now, Bert03241 said:

I really cant believe you can wipe your hand down it and come out clean, thats just not possible

I posted a video....

[Bert03241]

wow I dont see how its possible to burn thru leather and hav no char i'd like to see that with natural veg tan done

Edited May 25, 2022 by Bert03241

[Gulrok]

25 minutes ago, Bert03241 said:

wow I dont see how its possible to burn thru leather and hav no char i'd like to see that with natural veg tan done

I don't work with natural veg. I do a lot of fire and Ems equipment and belts. The lightest thing I cut is like a chestnut (HO). 

[RockyAussie]

5 hours ago, Gulrok said:

Hey Rocky. Its 12/14 oz English Bridle from RJF leather. No top seal.

Thanks for the video @Gulrok I would not have believed that possible without seeing it. Now I am starting to think of going bigger than my little 2.5 watt diode laser. How big a size cutting area can yours handle? Must be fairly big if you can cut belts. I assume there is some serious $$$$ to spend to get that far.