Putting rivets in middle of seam

[JeannieH]

Hi. I am making a bag and bed to put a rivet on the side just like this bag in the picture. My brain is telling me that putting a hole through the seam will make the thread break. But dooney and Bourke does it ...so there must be a way to do this without breaking the thread and risking a weak seam that will come apart. Anyone has any advice on doing this? Also what tools makes those grooves like the one on the loop? 

Edited November 19, 2017 by JeannieH

[battlemunky]

A wing divider or a groover with the blunt blade will make the groove on the loop.

As far as the rivet goes, I guess it would depend on the shank size of the rivet. I think if your stitches are far enough apart you could likely wiggle a rivet in between a stitch and then set the rivet. I'd keep an eye on the seam on the inside to make sure everything set fine.

[Matt S]

I don't mind putting a rivet into a seam, though usually at an end. This serves to not only lock the seam but to reinforce wear points. I would make sure that the threads (all four loose ends) are well caught by the rivet as it gets set.

Have you considered using a rivet like this?

 

Such a thing would make setting easier, and you may be able to get the spike/prong between stitches, rather than necessarily cutting the seam with a hole punch which you would with a semi-tubular rivet.

 

The lines around the edge can be done in a lot of ways. A wing divider as battlemunky suggests will work after a fashion (and if you don't have one I suggest you get one, they're very handy -- i have about a dozen somehow...). So too will an edge groover or racer, which slice out a very narrow piece of leather where you run it. However the effect I like the best (and I think how that bag was made) is with a screw crease, which has an end a bit like a butter knife with a guide that screws in and out. This is run along the leather, marking the line you see. The line is easier to make and more permanent if you heat it a little, or if using tooling leather you dampen it a tad.

Edited November 19, 2017 by Matt S

[buzzardbait]

the tool you are looking for is called a creaser. they are made in different sizes that determine the spacing of the line from the edge. 

[JeannieH]

Thank you both for the responses. Matt s,  Whatever river I use needs to have a post long enough to go through the leather. Do those types of rivets come with longer post? Buzzardbait I have been looking for an adjustable Osborne edge creaser but can't find one I can afford! I missed out on one on eBay and haven't been able to find a decent price since! I will keep looking.

[480volt]

It’s hard to see from the photo, but is the strap actually riveted to the bag? Looks like the load bearing connection is the sewn-in insert at the top. Can’t really make out what the bleed knot is threaded through.

[RockyAussie]

The hole through the seam shouldn't be any problem as you would usually put a reinforcing strip at the back to to take the load and that would be well glued into place. The stitching won't separate from the glue. Myself... I'd do a 2" by 1" strip about 2mm thick with skived edges.  Glue into place ...hole through the cetre of the lot and rivet into place.

[JeannieH]

Yes the rivet goes through the outside all the way to the lining. The order the bag needs to be sewn in leaves the loop holder needing to be secured last. Rocky Aussie, can you explain the reinforcing strip for me? Do you mean putting something in between the outside and lining? I've already made this bag from cork. This is my first time making a leather bag. The strap needed to be 3/4 to fit in that side opening. At least that's how I made the pattern. With the cork bag, I hand stitched the loop strap where the loop keeper is. But, putting a lot of things in the bag like water bottle..tablet, the stitches weren't strong enough and that undid. So, it needs that rivet since some women will want to put a lot of things in it since it's a big bag. Thanks for the advice . Rocky Aussie if you could give me a little more info on what you were talking about that would be awesome!

[Mattsbagger]

Couldn't you just make the strap that the loop is attached to long enough to go down inside the bag? Then it would be it's own reinforcement strap? You could also then use 2 rivets for extra strength. 

[RockyAussie]

18 hours ago, JeannieH said:

Yes the rivet goes through the outside all the way to the lining. The order the bag needs to be sewn in leaves the loop holder needing to be secured last. Rocky Aussie, can you explain the reinforcing strip for me? Do you mean putting something in between the outside and lining? I've already made this bag from cork. This is my first time making a leather bag. The strap needed to be 3/4 to fit in that side opening. At least that's how I made the pattern. With the cork bag, I hand stitched the loop strap where the loop keeper is. But, putting a lot of things in the bag like water bottle..tablet, the stitches weren't strong enough and that undid. So, it needs that rivet since some women will want to put a lot of things in it since it's a big bag. Thanks for the advice . Rocky Aussie if you could give me a little more info on what you were talking about that would be awesome!

Do you mean putting something in between the outside and lining? YES. The weight of the bag on to the rivet area in that type of seam would need a good bit of reinforcing to distribute the weight over a wider area and stop pressure going onto the seam stitching alone. I would even be tempted to do a little square stitch through the outer and reinforcing strip going over the seam top and bottom and around the rivet. This would be hidden by the strap when attached later. If you have the bag already made I would carefully try and stitch around the area where the rivet is to go right through the lining. This could lead to the lining not sitting right if you get it wrong though. Hope that helps. Brian

[JeannieH]

Also, should I open and glue down the side seams or leave them unskived and not glued down? I'm using 3.5 ounce chrome tanned upholstery fabric. 

Brian, would Bontex paper. E a good reinforcement? It's the strong paper used for like stiffening bags and using inside straps. If not...I would a thin leather be better? 

[RockyAussie]

9 hours ago, JeannieH said:

Also, should I open and glue down the side seams or leave them unskived and not glued down? I'm using 3.5 ounce chrome tanned upholstery fabric. 

Brian, would Bontex paper. E a good reinforcement? It's the strong paper used for like stiffening bags and using inside straps. If not...I would a thin leather be better? 

As you don't have a skiving machine yet I would leave it unskived and glue down only from the stitch line back about 1/8 to 3/16" leaving about half unglued. That is assuming your stitching around 3/8" in from the edges. Fully glued will show up on the outside and not look good. Do NOT pull back too firmly as that will tend to make the thread more noticible and also not look so good.I would do a few practice pieces and get the feel of how much tension is needed to make it come out just right.

I would use a bit of firmish leather for the reinforcement as it would adhere better and move with the bag more as it flexes around. ( less noticeable) . Regards Brian

[JeannieH]

2 hours ago, RockyAussie said:

As you don't have a skiving machine yet I would leave it unskived and glue down only from the stitch line back about 1/8 to 3/16" leaving about half unglued. That is assuming your stitching around 3/8" in from the edges. Fully glued will show up on the outside and not look good. Do NOT pull back too firmly as that will tend to make the thread more noticible and also not look so good.I would do a few practice pieces and get the feel of how much tension is needed to make it come out just right.

I would use a bit of firmish leather for the reinforcement as it would adhere better and move with the bag more as it flexes around. ( less noticeable) . Regards Brian

I do sew with a 3/8 seam. Forgive me but I don't understand how to only glue the 1/8 to 3/16. Are you saying...to fold over about that much toward the seam and glue that down? So the cut  edge folds over on either side about 1/8 to 3/16?  I'm so glad you answered this for me because I knew my seams weren't looking right! 

[RockyAussie]

 

 

Always hard to find a picture that shows what you want when you want it. I found a couple that should do alright I think. In the first picture I am doing a join on a bangle and it shows what I mean a bit in that you glue down at the thread seam and and away from the seam about 3/16" or so. If you glue all the way out on the 3/8 the edge will normally show up. With practice you learn to push the fold back toward the seam and not to pull it wide apart as that makes the stitching show up a lot. I was doing a run of pictures here on how to make these bangles and forgot to take some pictures when I finished them so.... next run maybe. There are a few bags we made in the following picture that show the seams as they should look when finished. Regards Brian