I'm dissapointed.........mainly in myself, I guess!

[Chris623]

Well, I'm disappointed.................mainly in me, but also this sheath I'm working on.

It's a folded sheath.  Got it all put together and nicely decorated and stitched.   I put two coats of Pro Resist on it, with 8 hours of dry time between the first and second coat.  Then an hour after the second coat I applied Fiebing's Dark Brown Antique Paste.  Let it dry for about 10 minutes and wiped it off.  And wipe it off I did!!!!!    The sheath was so shiny from the Pro Resist the Antiquing wouldn't stick...............and came right off.  Tried the process a second time and (Meh!) was able to get it to "sort of" look okay.  Not letting it dry long enough may be where I messed up.   (Also, I used a paper towel to remove the Antiquing, if that makes any difference)  This second time I let the Antique dry for about 15 minutes before wiping and then applied a coat of Tan Kote on it.  The Tan Kote dissolved the Antiquing and smeared it all over the sheath.   So then I had a muddy streaked mess!  Huge disappointment.  Thinking I needed to get all of that off the sheath, I started looking for a solvent to remove the Tan Kote.  After trying to dissolve a small bit of Tan Kote in about 5 different solvents I have, I (as a last resort) tried water.  The small puddle of Tan Kote in my cup dissolved readily in water.  So I took a wet rag and took all the muddy Tan Kote off the sheath.  What is left is the "far too shiny" Pro Resist.  So I softened the shine with some 0000 Steel Wool.   Out of frustration, I went ahead and finished the edges and inside of the sheath.  At this point, I'm not happy with it.  I wanted the stamping and lines to be darker than the rest of the sheath.  I've watched every video I can find on the subject and don't see why mine won't turn out the way "theirs" did.

I realize I'm new at this and this is only my second sheath, but I'm not used to making something that's not right.  But what upsets me is I don't know what I did wrong.  I still want to find a way to antique the stamping and pressed lines in the sheath.  Any helpful comments about what I may have done wrong would be greatly appreciated.

 

 

Edited November 17, 2020 by Chris623

[battlemunky]

First, Chris, welcome to the antiquing frustration club. We are legion!

As far as a correction for the piece, maybe when you get a chance you can try some of the gel antique? I use Tan Kote and Resolene as resists but I'd think Pro Resist would act similarly.

Let us know what you try and show some pics when you get a workable fix or sooner if you're feeling brave. As good as the last sheath turned out, it wouldn't surprise me if you aren't getting a decent result but your tolerance for imperfection may be blurring your vision. In any case, keep sharing as you go.

[Chris623]

Oh, I don't mind exposing my ignorance...............no shame in not knowing what I'm doing.  That's why I'm asking questions.

[TSes]

Try making your stamping deeper. Looks very shallow in the picture. You can see where the antique is still in the tips of your stamping. Those tips are deeper than the rest of the impression. Give the tool a couple good whacks. Same goes for your line work. Deeper is better. When possible, wipe off the antique across the lines, and not with the lines.

 

[Chris623]

Okay, thanks.  I was disappointed in how shallow the lines were, but thought the stamping was deep enough.  Oh, and I did wipe "across" the lines, but as you mentioned, they just weren't deep enough.

Edited November 17, 2020 by Chris623

[Scootch]

Also make sure your resist isn't put on too thick as to fill up the fine lines.  I haven't tried it but you can also thing your antique with tan kote. That might thin it enough to settle in the finer details.  Top coating with tan kote will always remove some antiquing.  

I've always used tan kotw as my resist but plan on trying resoline soon.

Scootch

[tsunkasapa]

I always had better luck with the older Antique stain and NO resist. All these new chemicals are just a PITA.

[Joshstrange]

I agree with using tan kote Don Gonzalez has a great video of an oil finish  tan kote for resist and then antique, its one of his multi segment videos cant remember which one for sure.  I only use the pro resist when I'm antiquing over a flower that I have painted for example.

[Chris623]

I sent a message to Fiebings last night.  I want to know the solvents or thinners used on each of their products.  My Pro Resist is so thick it reminds me of a bottle of Elmer's Glue that's almost dried up.  The Tan Kote isn't quite as bad, but still, it's thicker than I think it should be.  (so I tend to agree I may have filled the finer recesses in my stamping with the two coats of Pro Resist)  I remember seeing a video somewhere where the leather worker mentioned you could use Tan Kote in an artists air brush.  NO WAY.............unless you could thin it considerably.  And this folded sheath looks and feels more like plastic than leather now. 

I've seen leather workers use both Pro Resist and Tan Kote as interchangeable components.  One guy says he uses Pro Resist as a top coat and the other says he uses Tan Kote as a top coat. (opposite of what I did on this sheath)  Some say to use Antique paste and another says Antique Gel is what to use.............while another says "don't ever use the gel".  Driving me nuts. 

[chrisash]

With leather work there is normally a 1001 different answers to any question, just ask the right question, What sewing machine do i need, or How do i Finnish my edges

[Sheilajeanne]

My problem is usually the opposite - the antique makes the piece too dark! I find Resolene very thick, even when mixed with water 50/50 and have never had good luck with it. The finish turns out streaky.

I prefer the Tandy resist, but am still looking for something that protects my projects better so they don't stain too dark.

Like Battlemunky said, it's an area of leatherwork that frustrates a lot of us!

Edited November 17, 2020 by Sheilajeanne

[Josh Ashman]

I use the Fiebings liquid acrylic antique for brown, black and mahogany and really like all of them. I use Fiebings Hi-Liter for a lighter brown or tan and it works well for that. I generally don't use a resist but when I do I use some Neat-Lac that I've had for years, I know they don't make it anymore and haven't tried the "new" eco-flow kind so I'm not sure if it works. 

As for process, if resisting I put on a light coat of Neat-Lac with a paper towel. I do not saturate the leather, just a 1 pass wipe over the top. Then I let that dry. Overnight is best but I've been known to shorten up the dry time. If not using a resist I go straight to the antique which I apply with a scrap of shearling and make sure to work it into the tooling. I'll let that dry for several minutes. Then I wipe it off with a slightly damp paper towel trying to not get into the tooling too much. Let that all dry. Overnight is again best but I've shortened it up without too much issue. I top coat with Mop and Glo cut 50/50 with water and generally dip it to help avoid streaks. I've also used liquid glycerin saddle soap and scraps of shearling to "pre-clean" the item prior to top coating to further reduce the possibility of streaking. 

I do not recommend double hitting your stamps when tooling. If your impressions aren't deep enough case your leather better or hit the stamp harder the first time. Also make sure you're working on a solid surface with a marble slab (or steel or whatever) under your work. I don't like "plastic" looking leather either so I try to minimize the amount of sealers and top coats that I put on. Remember it's an art so it takes some doing to get the process down.

Good luck figuring out what works best for you!

All the best, Josh

 

[Chris623]

Thanks, Josh.  I picked up several pointers in all of that I want to try.   First off is only hitting the highlights with the resist.  Makes sense that the antique would stick better to the leather than the resist.  Also never thought of using a dampened paper towel to remove the antiquing.  Thanks for the comments.

[YinTx]

FYI, when I want very little of the antique to stick, I use Pro Resist.  Usually applied deliberately with a fine paint brush to the areas I want to have no color added by the antique.  It is a very strong resist.

TanKote on the other hand, is not as strong a resist, and it allows a lot of the color of the antique to pass through.  In some cases, no resist is the way to go.  The best way is to experiment on scrap bits, so you don't ruin the piece you have just spent hours and hours working on.  I still tend to do a sample or 4 using the same piece of leather my project is made from, and with different resists and antiques (gel, paste, liquid, whatever I think might do the trick to get the look I am after on the piece I have), since every hide and even different sections of the same hide will react differently each time.  And different techniques with the same products will give different results too. IE apply Tankote in 2 coats.  Dilute the Tankote, use a paper towel to wipe the antique, use sheepswool to wipe antique, etc. You just have to really play around a lot until you like what you get.

YinTx

[Chris623]

Okay, I tried to put to use some of the suggestions you guys have made and this is what I came up with.

Just a sample piece to make sure my stamping is deep enough.  I thinned my Pro Resist  and applied one thin coat.  Let it dry.   Then I applied Antiquing full strength with Sheepswool.  Let that dry about 15 minutes.  Gently wiped the top or highlights with slightly dampened paper towel.  Then one coat of thinned Top Kote.  I'm "fairly" pleased with the results.  Color of the Antique isn't my preference, but it's the only color they had at Tandy's.  I might try thinning it with Top Kote next time.  Over all, I'm pleased with this.  Just wish I could have had more of this "look" with the sheath I just finished.  Almost tempted to turn around and make it again!!!!!

[Scootch]

That looks nice.  

Someone mentioned the DG youtube video.  His method is what I use.  Maybe its the exposure of your camera but your leather looks to be really light in overall color,  I think the antique would look better if the leather was darkened by oiling before antiquing.  On the other hand, I basket stamped a belt with intentions of antiquing but the Herman oak burnished so nicely the color contrast was great so I just died the edges and applied tan kote and left it at that.

I've never air brushed tan kote but a few weeks ago I airbrushed a holster with 5050 Resoline and water, for the first time, and was very pleased with how it turned out.  I was using a painters airbrush at 35 psi with the large needle and cone. It applied very thin and even.

Scootch

[Chris623]

You are correct, the exposure of the camera was slightly off..................but I didn't oil the sample first.  I haven't tried that yet, but will next time.

I don't own an air brushing system.  That's something I've seriously considered for my wood carving work.  My hobbies are all far too expensive.   My little wife is about to divorce me over all of them as it is.  I'll have to wait until I can sell a bunch of my larger wood working equipment (or my beautiful wooden teardrop trailer!) before I can spring for that!!!!!

Edited November 18, 2020 by Chris623

[battlemunky]

Airbrush wise, Harbor Freight with a coupon is your friend. You don't need an expensive set up for dyeing leather. I think with the compressor and the brush I spent <$100.

[Chris623]

Maybe I can come up with a hundred bucks if I win a scratch card.

[TexasJack]

Frustration - we should start a thread on that.  The number of times we worked really hard - only to discover we did it backwards.  The number of times we splashed dye somewhere we didn't want it to go. The stitch that went sideways.

It happens.

 

[Sheilajeanne]

Oh yes!!  We've all had those  moments!

 

Chris, like your fortune cookie proverb - too true!

Edited December 4, 2020 by Sheilajeanne

[tsunkasapa]

Just last week my granddaughter spilled red dye over ALL of the key fobs she was doing for Christmas. 

[fredk]

Red = a Christmas seasonal colour.  Fortunate I'd say, they can be rescued

[Sheilajeanne]

Fred,   

Definitely some truth in that!

Yes, some errors have happy endings! I once covered up a an edge bevel that went wrong by adding lacing to the edge of the pocket!

And fortunately, the one major dye spill I've had missed my project. It got just about everything else in my work area, including my shoes, but thank GOD, the project was okay!

It was one of those last minute touch-ups where you're in too much of a hurry to take the usual precautions with the dye...lesson learned!