When I price my piece, it feels too high

[Warhauk]

I know there are algorithms for prices our work and the one I've been trying to follow is roughly the (material + time) x 2. Then, I feel like the prices is too high so usually end up lowering it a bit further even though I suspect I am already undervaluing my time aspect quite a bit (I'm a little bit slow on my production speed but still am probably undercutting my time too much).

But then I look at the price I am trying to sell and it feels too high still. For example, pricing out a set of 4 bondage cuffs, which cost me about $10 to make per cuff, and doing the hand stitching, hand dying, etc. Even if I only value my time at $10/hr AND assume it only takes 1 hour to make a cuff (which I am pretty sure it takes a decent bit longer but I tend to have issues timing, with other responsibilities and breaks and stuff), I would be charging about $40 per cuff, where as on etsy, similar looking things (though most likely lower quality but they look pretty similar) are like $40-80 for an entire set of 4 cuffs, collar, and leash.

I am just feeling pretty disheartened trying to sell my stuff when competing with these mass producers.

[chrisash]

The other maker is probably mass producing them, I would suggest you do a trial say making 2 sets at the same time, cutting out, dyeing, edges and so on and see how much quicker it is with little wasted time

 

[chuck123wapati]

1 hour ago, Warhauk said:

 

I am just feeling pretty disheartened trying to sell my stuff when competing with these mass producers.

the leather crafters lament!!!! 

You cant compete its just that simple. They use machines you dont. You can compete with others who hand sew and you can make a better product but you cant duplicate machine work by hand and come out on top.

 A little story, the other day i took a couple holsters to a customer, while talking he showed me a pancake holster he had purchased previous to finding me. It was two pieces of 4oz pre dyed chrome tan leather , cut with a clicker press, sewn on a machine in a very basic stitch pattern that was conceived to cover about a hundred different gun shapes, edges unfinished not even beveled. Probably not 30 minutes of work to put it together including a coffee break. Whomever could make a  box full of these crappy holsters in the time i make one. Big old stamp right on the front Stamped HANDCRAFTED by!  Less than two minutes and the fellow understood the difference in quality plainly. He would have bought from me if he knew i made holsters at the time but I have all his leather work now as well as everyone he tells. And yes i can make more than just holsters for my customers. Quality will sell your work if you want to sell handmade items! but your only going to get people who want handmade quality and most of those folks know what handmade looks like to some degree. His wife went over my stitching like a detective lol. I impressed her on the stitching quality and i impressed him on the speed of the order and quality fit of the holster. 

If you feel you need to compete then by all means buy the machines and put the quality out there that they are selling. THERE is a learning curve to that also!

I will say now there are people who can make clicker cut machine sewn stuff every bit as good or better than most hand makers can. They are truly your competition!

I will also say if you cant sew as fast, cut as fast, dye as fast, as other hand makers you cant charge for all that time (other responsibilities and breaks and stuff). In the beginning your going to make substandard wages, reality is sick days don't make you money, vacations don't make you money.  You now have only yourself to blame for your success.

[PastorBob]

i normally price it material *2 + $15/ hour.  It seems to work well for me.  My main product is holsters, I can make an avenger style holster in about 1.5 hours of labor time (doesn't include dry time).  I charge about $65 +/- shipping.  I should probably charge more, but I am happy getting that and it allows me to restock my supplies.  Etsy sucks.  Marketplace sucks.  Because you are competing with mass producers.  I do have my items listed on a new site just for hand made leather products.  It is fairly new, but it is all handmade stuff listed.  It would be more for the higher end buyer I would guess.

[Warhauk]

3 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

the leather crafters lament!!!! 

You cant compete its just that simple. They use machines you dont. You can compete with others who hand sew and you can make a better product but you cant duplicate machine work by hand and come out on top.

 A little story, the other day i took a couple holsters to a customer, while talking he showed me a pancake holster he had purchased previous to finding me. It was two pieces of 4oz pre dyed chrome tan leather , cut with a clicker press, sewn on a machine in a very basic stitch pattern that was conceived to cover about a hundred different gun shapes, edges unfinished not even beveled. Probably not 30 minutes of work to put it together including a coffee break. Whomever could make a  box full of these crappy holsters in the time i make one. Big old stamp right on the front Stamped HANDCRAFTED by!  Less than two minutes and the fellow understood the difference in quality plainly. He would have bought from me if he knew i made holsters at the time but I have all his leather work now as well as everyone he tells. And yes i can make more than just holsters for my customers. Quality will sell your work if you want to sell handmade items! but your only going to get people who want handmade quality and most of those folks know what handmade looks like to some degree. His wife went over my stitching like a detective lol. I impressed her on the stitching quality and i impressed him on the speed of the order and quality fit of the holster. 

If you feel you need to compete then by all means buy the machines and put the quality out there that they are selling. THERE is a learning curve to that also!

I will say now there are people who can make clicker cut machine sewn stuff every bit as good or better than most hand makers can. They are truly your competition!

I will also say if you cant sew as fast, cut as fast, dye as fast, as other hand makers you cant charge for all that time (other responsibilities and breaks and stuff). In the beginning your going to make substandard wages, reality is sick days don't make you money, vacations don't make you money.  You now have only yourself to blame for your success.

I appreciate the anecdote. I am definitely more interested in quality work rather than speedy work and it is nice to hear that people do recognize the difference. I just need to build a customer base and I'm sure it will take some time. On a side note, I was not aware that using a clicker press makes something less handmade. I honestly assumed that it was one of the normal methods for cutting leather and is on my list of items to get by reinvesting my profits, whenever that day may come. The stitching, I'm going to stick with doing that by hand for quite a while. I just need to work on streamlining my process and speeding up once I feel confident with my quality.

Edited December 29, 2021 by Warhauk

[Warhauk]

3 hours ago, PastorBob said:

i normally price it material *2 + $15/ hour.  It seems to work well for me.  My main product is holsters, I can make an avenger style holster in about 1.5 hours of labor time (doesn't include dry time).  I charge about $65 +/- shipping.  I should probably charge more, but I am happy getting that and it allows me to restock my supplies.  Etsy sucks.  Marketplace sucks.  Because you are competing with mass producers.  I do have my items listed on a new site just for hand made leather products.  It is fairly new, but it is all handmade stuff listed.  It would be more for the higher end buyer I would guess.

I may look into the pricing and compare it with the one I've been trying to use. It's unfortunate that we have to compete with the mass producers considering etsy is supposed to be handmade stuff only, but loopholes and all. May I ask what website you are referring to?

[DustinSmith]

We as small time leather workers do have 2 big advantages over the mass producers and thats the ability to pivot on design and products much faster and being able to offer customization and personalization. You can't go to someone who mass produces this stuff and get a bespoke holster, belt etc. And thats where we fit in, the personalized aspect of it, people will pay more for something unique

[Spyros]

This is my understanding on prices (based on 20 years of setting prices for a living):

It's a misunderstanding that you set your price.   Maybe you think you do, but you don't, your market sets the price and there's nothing you can do to change it, all you're trying to do is guess what it is and put it on the sticker.  If you guess wrong and put it too high you lose the sale, if you put it too low you're leaving money on the table. 

When you're doing your material cost + labour calculations, that calculation is irrelevant, and if you ever get the price right it is merely a coincidence.   You are turning a toy plastic wheel on your child's car seat, sometimes the car turns the way you turn, and sometimes it doesn't.

What I'm saying is: if you don't like the price the market is setting for your product, there's nothing you can do about it but change the product or the market, you can't change the price.   People go to etsy expecting to pay a certain amount, because they're shopping at etsy.  If they go to Madison Avenue in NY they expect to pay something else because it's Madison Avenue, it's a different market.  If you can't make a profit at etsy prices, don't be the random etsy guy, be the lone artisan who makes a limited number of high quality items for select connoisseurs.  I mean I just paid USD$800 to a guy like that for a pair of hand made boots.  Is it easy to be that guy?  No it's not, it takes years, but it's doable.

[Spyros]

My advice is, don't make something and then try to figure out what it cost you and come up with a price.  That's a recipe for disaster.

Do it the opposite way:  Start from finding the price that people are actually paying for something, in a specific market that you can enter. 

When you find that price, work backwards and see if you can make that thing for significantly less than that price, and only then consider actually making it.  Make a prototype, try to guess how much it would cost to make it again and again.  And if the numbers still work, make and sell it for the price you found at the start.  Maybe a little lower at the start, as you're trying to break into the market, and then gently grow your prices as you're building up your name recognition.

[TonyV]

9 hours ago, Warhauk said:

similar looking things (though most likely lower quality 

there you have it..    If yours is higher quality, you certainly have the right to charge a higher price.  sell the quality!

and learn to streamline your processes to spend less time in production to improve your bottom line.

Working in batches can help.  If you're making several sets of like items, use patterns to cut them all at the same time. Then move on the next step that they all have in common, etc.