Red Cent

Always ask "Are you sure" three times before you cut.

Hey Charles, just FYI. The "full" size (Colt) 1911 has a 5" barrel. The Commander has a 4 1/2" barrel and the Officer's model has a 3 1/2" barrel. The full size is much more prevalant.

Did you see the thumbnail of my red one on the first page?

The application of any finish by hand is a problem for me. I am going to buy another gun to do the same.

For cowboy competition, I use 8-9 out and a 4-5 liner. Same on the belt. I am not an expert on leather quality but the leather from Zack's does well and looks good (to me).

And it depends on what is an "offset". Want the handgun butt away from the body but not the barrel. Or turned as Dwight has suggested. Is the holster for competition, carry, or......................

How would you guys rate this leather? http://www.zackwhite.com/8-10-oz-Vegetable-Tanned-Imported-Double-Shoulders-Mexico_p_3633.html

I just bought this from Zack White Leather in Ramseur, NC. Works very well. Gives a semi gloss to leather. A little shine but not glassy. Some customers like the shine and it is a sealer. http://www.zackwhite...art_p_2012.html

Its gonna flap all over the place. Customer is always right.

I use a #24 or a #25 needle. I used the 277 bonded nylon top and bottom with a 25 needle as the machine was set up from the shop. I strongly feel the use of 207 on the bottom helped. And I believe the poly threa helped. 379 ways. The tension on the thread can be affected with just a little resistance. I had some trouble with skipped stitches and out of the side of my vision, I noticed the thread was just so lightly "snagging" on the spool. Then I noticed everytime the snag happened, I got a skipped stitch. It always mystified me what kind of tremendous resistance the double wrap around the bottom disc caused. I think I increased the resistance at that spot when I started to using the lube pot. Had to. Since I don't wrap twice, I can pull excess thread out when I finish. I still have scars on my fingers trying to pull the thread out. And the presser foot was raised.

There is a leathercrafter here and at Cas City. He posted a way to get the bobbin tension "correct" on the C4. And It would apply to the 4500. I did it and it works very well. I do agree that most tension problems can be solved with the top tension discs. Some or most may not agree with the correct way to thread a C4 but the proof is in the leather. As I have stated, I have communicated with a couple who did it their way. And I like the polyester thread. Surprised Steve has not hopped in here. http://www.cascity.c...ic,47819.0.html

C'mon C4 owners. Help this guy out with some suggestions.

Now I understand. Thanks.

" knotting will not make it stronger ". That sounds counter intuitive. Bear with me please. I attempt to plan my stitching so as to not end a line of stitch where tension will be placed. On a pancake holster, I try to start at the bottom and end at the bottom. Using "my" logic, pulling the top thread through the hole and tying the square knot does make this area strong. Molding a holster after it is sewn causes stress in a lot of places. Not necessarily the "weak" places. After the leather dries, it is, of course, fairly solid. I can't get my head around the knot not making the area stronger. Or maybe I should say "keep the thread from coming loose". Hopefully, I will progress and be able to make clean double lines of stitches:).

Another one. BTW, I have been at this for a few months. The machine has a decent learning curve. Read, read, read, and watch videos.

The C4 problem, eh? I am sure you have watched the videos and talked to Steve or someone at the shop. And I can attest that there are some of us who have ventured into the scary arena of thread tension. And, for what it is worth, here is where I landed. First I switched to polyester thread. 277 top and 207 bottom. I thread from the spool, up to the arm, then to a lube pot. Filled with glycerin sadle soap. From the pot to the wire eyelet, over the top and down. Not around the disc. I do click it into the disk. Down to the next wire eyelet and counter clockwise around the disc but out and through the spring eyelet. I do not go around the disc twice. Up to the take up arm and the rest as usual. I have learned to do what John Bianchi does when he gets ready to sew. Sew about a foot on scrap the same thickness as the piece you are getting ready to sew. The other day, after a number of projects, I rewound a bobbin, got it ready to sew and the top thread was not pulling through very well. A 1/4 turn clockwise on the top disc solved it. Oh yeah. My tension screws are backed out all the way. Just enough tight to stay on the spring. Sounds weird and maybe blasphemy. This through two 8-9 ounce veg tanned. Other is 8-9 with 4-5 outside. I have not had a skipped stitch in a long time. And my stitches are very uniform. I hope others will post and let them show you good work with full tension. The other day, I communicated with a C4 owner and he was putting the post on top of his C4, just like the Cowboy 4500. They are the same machine. Leather Machine Company tossed the post stating that their test found it was not needed. I have said it before. There is probably 379 (I think that was the number used) ways to thread the C4 and get a good, consistent stitch. Good Luck.

I use the C4 and do not like the looks of the back stitching. The doubled up stitches stand out. I don't think two back stitches is enough on some areas that receive a lot of stress. Any more stitches look worse. I am pulling on the inside thread bringing the top thread through and tying a square knot. I have used super glue but it is difficult to not leave traces of the glue, especially on light leather. I have not attempted the soldering iron but it seems as this would do away with at least half of the square knot and leather tension would separate the knot. I have read that some tie a knot and push it inside the hole. This would seem to work until tension is exerted and the knot will pop out on the side with more tension. Am I missing something?

Southern Cross, I use polyester thread. 277 top and 207 on bottom.

Hidepounder, please jump in. I have been following his method and it is doing real well except..............that even line that he gets. Hidepounder, do you leave the shoulder caused by the edger and round off the center of the belt/holster...? I have been sanding that shoulder off in trying to get a perfect round edge. However, in using your method, when I run into a remnant of the shoulder the dye does very well. Please don't tell me you tape it off Anybody?

Cyber, I cannot include the spray gun I bought in an auto spray gun class. It is an inexpensive gravity fed gun that I have not used. I keep putting it off because it uses "oil" paints only. Recently I sprayed a holster with the "airbrush" but I had to continue to cover the holster completely time and time again to get a "continuing" color. Dark brown. Every pass produced a strip of different color until I had it so dark it didn't matter. Eventually, I will try the gun and see what I can accomplish. In my brain, there is a scene where after a couple of passes with the "gun", I can stop and enjoy an even and "different" look but not a mottled mess. I am not concerned with a little waste. Hey, I can see where you are coming from but the Type A personality has to go for it.

Thanks RiverCity. I am sure I have a lot to learn using either method. But I am also convinced the gun has its place. Maybe a better airbrush but I am going to try the gun.

I have found that the airbrush does well if you are careful not to overlap too much. I am using Fiebings spirit dye and it applys well. I don't want (I think) to go to oil dye but I may. It seems that the spray gun will almost cover the holster with one motion and make it easire to cover evenly. Would someone please post their success with the spray gun. Or tell us what is wrong with the spray gun?

I hear from the guys that they are tired of the plastic and want leather holsters. I would think that once sewn onto the kydex, a heat gun used with caution could be used to form the kydex to the gun. The kydex in the picture looks to be lightly molded ( American English has no mould, and British English has no mold. In other words, the word referring to (1) the various funguses that grow on organic matter or (2) a frame for shaping something is spelled the same in both uses, and the spelling depends on the variety of English.) and could be formed very quickly. Should I mentally prepare for the sound of the needle punching through the kydex? Wow!!

Whoa! You mean a Cobra 4 will sew through the leather and the kydex? Any special needle?

Ran across this looking at different styles of 1911 holsters. How does one sew through kydex?