Carving question

[dikman]

I'm about to start on a couple of holsters, they'll be a modified Slim Jim style for my cap and ball revolvers. I intent to carve them (should be interesting ) and am still learning how to draw the pattern. They'll be lined, heavier leather on the outside and my question is- should I carve the outer piece before gluing on the liner, or glue the liner and then carve?

I can think of reasons to do it either way, but is one way better than the other?

[fredk]

Others will have far better advice on this cos I've never made a holster. I've just been reading up on how to make a Slim Jim and the advice is to glue the liner on with the outside leather curved. If you do it this way it would be awkward to cut and tool the outside, it would be easier if you do the tooling first then glue in the lining 

[dikman]

Yes, I've read the same thing about gluing the liner while curving the holster. I know from experience how much effort it takes to fold a lined holster, on the other hand gluing the liner first makes it easier to get a good bond as once it's tooled I can't use a hammer or roller to apply pressure to the two parts.

Hence my quandary.

[bland]

In my opinion, I would carve then line.  Carving and stamping requires a solid surface to get good impressions.  Then add the complexity of carving a rounded object.  A swell cover on a western saddle at least has a solid surface under the leather but you're carving at odd angles.  I'm thinking with a holster it might be more tricky to keep the solid surface where you need it.  

I think the bond for gluing will be ok as it will inevitably slightly bigger than it needs to be when you get get the holster closed up.  Just another opinion.

 

[tsunkasapa]

Tool first. When the leather is dry, tapping with a mallet or using a roller will not hurt it.

[chuck123wapati]

13 hours ago, dikman said:

I'm about to start on a couple of holsters, they'll be a modified Slim Jim style for my cap and ball revolvers. I intent to carve them (should be interesting ) and am still learning how to draw the pattern. They'll be lined, heavier leather on the outside and my question is- should I carve the outer piece before gluing on the liner, or glue the liner and then carve?

I can think of reasons to do it either way, but is one way better than the other?

yeesh thats a quandary alright

i think it depends a lot on the thickness of inner liner if your using very thin i dont see much problem at all doing it either way. But the question is how thick of a liner can you get away with before wrinkling inside I would tool a bit of scrap and run some quick tests to see if forming after gluing would cause wrinkling.

you may also want to think about skiving you outer piece along the bend before gluing in the liner , that may help reduce the problem with liner wrinkles and softening of the tooling impressions both are caused by the leather bunching up and or stretching out.

I would also love to find out your progress i have a slim Jim to make for my dads old shooter also but I've never lined them shh don't tell the guns they think they are nice and comfy living in the rough.

anyway i tool very deep then form my  unlined holsters because you lose some impression when forming around the bend, i expect it and tell my customers to expect it as well.

 

[Dwight]

If you do not want your liner to wrinkle . . . 

Tool first . . . LET IT DRY . . . LET IT DRY . . . LET IT DRY

Make up the inside piece . . . cut it about 1/2 inch too big all the way around . . . 

Bend your outside piece by rolling it on a tee shirt with a 3/4 inch or so dowel . . . bend it around the dowel . . . and by rolling it back and forth several times will cause it to take a curve.

Once you get the curve built into it . . . lay your liner inside it . . . take an ink pen and trace around the outside onto the liner . . . glue up the liner . . . glue up the outer shell . . . let them dry (using contact cement) until they just get past "tacky" dry . . . 

Lay the outside piece on some thing that will hold it steady  with both sides pointing up . . . 

Bend the liner in the middle . . . push it down into the center . . . taking your fingers on one hand . . . pinch it onto the sides of the outside piece . . . check your outside lines on the liner you marked . . . make sure you are down in where you should be . . . 

Use that same 3/4 inch dowel to roll the liner up against the outside piece by rolling it as you did earlier.  Trim . . . edge . . . bevel . . . sew . . . and admire your handiwork.

May God bless,

Dwight

[Chakotay]

My process is:  

1. Cut out leather pattern.

2. Carve and tool.

3. Dye.

4. Apply neatsfoot oil/conditioner.

5. Glue liner (if using anything thicker than say, 1oz leather for the liner material, glue "in the round". Otherwise the liner will wrinkle and generally look bad when folded.)

 

[KYCat]

1 hour ago, Chakotay said:

My process is:  

1. Cut out leather pattern.

2. Carve and tool.

3. Dye.

4. Apply neatsfoot oil/conditioner.

5. Glue liner (if using anything thicker than say, 1oz leather for the liner material, glue "in the round". Otherwise the liner will wrinkle and generally look bad when folded.)

 

In my experience of tooling to a given size, you may want to add a '1A' to the process. After cutting out the outer piece before tooling, I will put masking tape on the back to keep it from spreading out during/after tooling. Found out the hard way that the show side was too big for the liner.

YMMV

Good luck!

 

Edited May 16, 2022 by KYCat

[dikman]

Thanks everyone, it looks like carving first is the way to go. At this stage I don't intend to do any border stamping, although that may change, my thinking is that "simpler is better", with just a grooved edge around the carving. My first issue is to try and master the principles of Sheridan-style patterns. I have the template made up for the holster size now I have to design a pattern to fit (I didn't like my first attempt, it just didn't look right).

Going to be a slow job!