High torque servo motor for heavy duty leather sewing machine

[sbrownn]

1 hour ago, kgg said:

Must be a typo. If it pulls 16 amps on startup it may pose a problem for some 15 amp main circuit breakers particularly if they have anything else on that circuit. So I am going to assume you meant to say 1.60 amps.

At 4.43 seconds into the video the nameplate is for Voltage : AC 200 -240 50-60 HZ so what is the expected current draw on the standard North American household voltage of 120 volts on a 15 amp circuit or does this motor require a dedicated 220 volt 20 amp circuit.

kgg

1.6 amps @ 110 volts would only be 176 watts.  My guess would be that while running it might draw somewhere around 6 amps @ 120 volts and I don't know what the starting current for a servo motor is but my servos start and run fine on a 110 volt 15 amp circuit.  I'm sure the motor probably runs fine off of a typical household circuit as it looks to be just a pretty common servo motor...nothing special.

I'm not sure the author of the post knows what he is talking about and I sure wouldn't trust any information coming from this advertisement.

[CowBoyOUTLAW]

23 minutes ago, sbrownn said:

Oh, so it draws 160 amps at 220 volts?

Power = Volts x Amps = 160 x 220 = 35,200 watts = 47 horsepower?

 

There must be a misatke. Let me check with our engineer. 

[kgg]

8 hours ago, sbrownn said:

I'm not sure the author of the post knows what he is talking about and I sure wouldn't trust any information coming from this advertisement.

I would say you have a disconnect between the Engineering guys and the Advertising guys. The information so far is really not helpful.

There is no way the numbers work out even on 220 volt systems as the motor tested was made for EU systems. To use their motor on a 120 volt system the amp draw would be approximately twice or according to their figures 320 amps. Most new homes in North America only run 200 or 225 amp main services.

kgg

[sbrownn]

2 hours ago, kgg said:

I would say you have a disconnect between the Engineering guys and the Advertising guys. The information so far is really not helpful.

There is no way the numbers work out even on 220 volt systems as the motor tested was made for EU systems. To use their motor on a 120 volt system the amp draw would be approximately twice or according to their figures 320 amps. Most new homes in North America only run 200 or 225 amp main services.

kgg

I sure want a sewing machine motor that draws more current than my water heater, electric stove and electric furnace combined...LOL.

[kgg]

2 hours ago, sbrownn said:

I sure want a sewing machine motor that draws more current than my water heater, electric stove and electric furnace combined...LOL.

 

13 hours ago, CowBoyOUTLAW said:

here must be a misatke. Let me check with our engineer. 

While you are checking with your Engineer please also ask if the motor and or components are CE, UL or CSA approved.

kgg

[dikman]

20 hours ago, CowBoyOUTLAW said:

What's wrong? The clutch motor will be noise as long as you feed the electricity. It is the advantage of sevo motor. 

 . I couldn't find the head-scratching emoji.

 

 

Edited October 8, 2022 by dikman

[dikman]

10 hours ago, kgg said:

I would say you have a disconnect between the Engineering guys and the Advertising guys.

kgg

 That would never happen - much!

Obviously no-one bothered to check the advertising before releasing it.

[kgg]

3 hours ago, dikman said:

Obviously no-one bothered to check the advertising before releasing it.

They would have been better to have a done a pre release review like a lot of computer companies do when they are about ready to release new hard drives/ chip sets / coolers / motherboards / etc to qualified reviewer users.

kgg

[dikman]

I guess it's no different to many of the manuals and handbooks that are released with goods made in China. What would it cost them, in the scheme of things, to hire someone who is actually fluent in English to proof-read them prior to printing?

[Constabulary]

1 hour ago, dikman said:

I guess it's no different to many of the manuals and handbooks that are released with goods made in China. What would it cost them, in the scheme of things, to hire someone who is actually fluent in English to proof-read them prior to printing?

or as a dealer / distributor to sit down for 1 or 2 hours and compile one. That would reduce customer headache and questions - I guess.

[RockyAussie]

16 hours ago, Constabulary said:

That would reduce customer headache and questions - I guess

This is only a problem if one were feeling any need to answer those questions..................

 

18 hours ago, dikman said:

I guess it's no different to many of the manuals and handbooks that are released with goods made in China. What would it cost them, in the scheme of things, to hire someone who is actually fluent in English to proof-read them prior to printing?

You misunderstand kind sir......If these manuals appeared insufficiently stupid, for one the phrase WTF may never have come into place. Secondly the people might make the mistake and think that what is written there might sometimes be correct and then rely on that information.

[CowBoyOUTLAW]

18 hours ago, dikman said:

I guess it's no different to many of the manuals and handbooks that are released with goods made in China. What would it cost them, in the scheme of things, to hire someone who is actually fluent in English to proof-read them prior to printing?

Very good point, I agree with you, most English manuals of Chinese machines are not easy to understand, even in Chinese 5 stars hotels, “Chinese English” is the most common problem. We try to provide easy to understand English, but not native. 

[CowBoyOUTLAW]

17 hours ago, Constabulary said:

or as a dealer / distributor to sit down for 1 or 2 hours and compile one. That would reduce customer headache and questions - I guess.

Thank you, Ryan O. Neel from Ohio, USA will translate the English instruction manual.  Now he cannot come to China, so we are still wating...

[Gunnarsson]

About the current, electric motors (depending on type, controlling electronics and so on) can draw a very high inrush current initially, but that settles down to a far lower current once rpm and load stabilizes. The picture is from a relative compression test of (probably) a small car engine, where the starter current is measured to see if all cylinder compression events puts an equal load on the starter = they all draw the same current. As you can see it settles at around 120A, but the initial load of getting a bunch of heavy engine parts moving gives a peak current around 500A.

Don't know the exact construction of the servo motor, but 160A isn't impossible. Not very interesting though, as the inrush current lasts such a short time, what it settles down to is more relevant.

[Northmount]

2 hours ago, Gunnarsson said:

Don't know the exact construction of the servo motor, but 160A isn't impossible. Not very interesting though, as the inrush current lasts such a short time, what it settles down to is more relevant.

You are missing the fact that this is as noted above, a 220VAC motor, not a 12VDC motor.  Leads to the AC motor are only about #14 cable versus the heavy battery cables used on 12VDC engine starting motors.

Typical AC induction motors draw up to 7x running current during starting.  Circuit breakers and fuses for such loads work on both time and current.  Their application will be designed/based on time overcurrent.  This is to protect the supply lines, not the motor, though it may protect the motor in many cases.

160A at 220VAC is way out of range for a sewing machine motor, an obvious mistake in publishing the specifications.  This would fry the supply leads in a few seconds if not instantly.  Would also drag the voltage down for the building and possibly the neighbours before it blows.  No one would be happy with this!

[kgg]

41 minutes ago, Northmount said:

You are missing the fact

A couple of simple formulas:

1) Horsepower measured in HP or Watts where 745.7 watts equals 1 hp

2) Horsepower = Voltage (measure in volts) X Current (measured in amps)

750 watt motor would have a max current draw (not including any inrush on startup) of:

i) 3.4 amps at 220 volts

ii) 6.8 amps at 110 volts

3) Horsepower = Motor speed in rpm X Torque measure in Nm or lbf-ft / 7127 (metric) or 5252 (imperial).

OR

i) HP = 0.000140304 x T(Nm)*rpm

ii) HP = .000190403 x lbf-ft x rpm

kgg

 

[nylonRigging]

4 hours ago, kgg said:

A couple of simple formulas:

1) Horsepower measured in HP or Watts where 745.7 watts equals 1 hp

2) Horsepower = Voltage (measure in volts) X Current (measured in amps)

750 watt motor would have a max current draw (not including any inrush on startup) of:

i) 3.4 amps at 220 volts

ii) 6.8 amps at 110 volts

3) Horsepower = Motor speed in rpm X Torque measure in Nm or lbf-ft / 7127 (metric) or 5252 (imperial).

OR

i) HP = 0.000140304 x T(Nm)*rpm

ii) HP = .000190403 x lbf-ft x rpm

kgg

 

 

Thank You .

.

[CowBoyOUTLAW]

On 10/9/2022 at 5:29 AM, dikman said:

 That would never happen - much!

Obviously no-one bothered to check the advertising before releasing it.

Sorry, I am not good at technology.

 

[Deryk]

did anyone ever find out how much?

[Quade]

800 watts = 110V * Amps

Amps = about 7 amps. 

https://www.tolindsewmach.com/motors.html

I believe this is his site.  I can't find the motor he showed us in this ad. 

[Wizcrafts]

2 hours ago, Quade said:

https://www.tolindsewmach.com/motors.html

I believe this is his site.  I can't find the motor he showed us in this ad. 

That is not his website! CowboyOutlaw in not affiliated with Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines, which is owned by Bob Kovar. They are a Cowboy dealer under the brand's US distributor. They are also a Consew and Juki dealer and sell refurbished Singer machines and other brands. CowboyOutlaw is affiliated with that other company. As for motors, Toledo Industrial currently sells the Consew CSM-550-1 servo motor. Previously, they sold the Family Sew FS-550s servos. I have 6 of those on my machines.

[CowboyBob]

We just got some 750 watt Consew motors in & it sells for $189.00 or $219.00 w/needle postioner.We also can install the 45mm pulley @ no charge, since they come with a 3" or 75mm so they will run slower.Prices include shpg in the lower 48 states.

[Quade]

Quote

That is not his website! CowboyOutlaw in not affiliated with Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines, which is owned by Bob Kovar.

Dooh!  Thanks.  Too many cowboys....

 

Edited January 11, 2023 by Quade

[Wizcrafts]

16 hours ago, Quade said:

Too many cowboys

You can't have too many Cowboys! 1883, 1923,  Yellowstone on!

[Ana1234]

Since your conversation last year, did anyone purchase this Kinedyne motor? If so, what's the verdict?