WILL SOMEBODY PLEASE GIVE ME A DIRECT ANSWER TO MY QUESTIONS

[bryan4christ]

I won't name any names but I've asked some of the "best" here on this site some simple questions and all I've gotten is crap in response

Can somebody please tell me....

.....what leatherwork will bring in the highest rate of return?   I Live in Northern California.....

.....does handmade leatherwork sell for more or does it just take too much time?

.....what outlets do you use to sell your leather goods?

....I just need some honest straight forward answers

[LatigoAmigo]

10 minutes ago, bryan4christ said:

....I just need some honest straight forward answers

Leather working is a tough business, and very few make it, so most of us on this site are hobbyists and happy.

[480volt]

I’m going to be a little more direct than LatigoAmigo. Maybe the “best” contributors (whatever that means) are busy, or haven’t logged in for a while, or didn’t want to answer questions that you could answer yourself with diligent searching. 

It astounds me that professionals, and I don’t mean people making side money selling holsters and stuff to their buddies, who are willing to share their time and techniques and talk openly about their businesses and marketing. If you just google “leatherworker marketing” you will find a thread that stretched over years discussing people’s approach to leatherwork as a business. 

So do your own legwork. If you can’t at least put that much effort into it, you surely aren’t going to make any money at this. I know I don’t, but I never intended to, so maybe my opinion is just more “crap”.

 

[chrisash]

There is no one answer to your questions

Most leather workers who make money have chosen a niche product range and spent money marketing their goods , just like any other business

Some will make well made items for others to sell, Brian in Australia appears to make goods especially for a well known outlet selling high value goods with gator leather among other things and produce the same item in quite large numbers gaining the advantage of small mass production

Others may concentrate on Holsters or tooling, but whatever you do you need to identify your market and investigate how you will get sales from that market. Hermes does not sell in small town shops as a rule but concentrates on high value stores where their customers are, alternatively your split leather cheap belts will be found in every low cost clothing store

Tiny one man bands often find it hard to identify their market and dont have the money to advertise, but just put up a very basic website and hope for the best. 

Customers got to shows or country fairs for many reasons not necessary to buy goods, but depending on the audience impulse buys can be high or low value goods, but high value are normally thought about products rather than impulse buy

Some leather workers don't want to keep making the same product day in day out others find it rewarding, the only rule is Time must be spent efficiently

[LumpenDoodle2]

2 hours ago, chrisash said:

There is no one answer to your questions

Most leather workers who make money have chosen a niche product range and spent money marketing their goods , just like any other business

Some will make well made items for others to sell, Brian in Australia appears to make goods especially for a well known outlet selling high value goods with gator leather among other things and produce the same item in quite large numbers gaining the advantage of small mass production

Others may concentrate on Holsters or tooling, but whatever you do you need to identify your market and investigate how you will get sales from that market. Hermes does not sell in small town shops as a rule but concentrates on high value stores where their customers are, alternatively your split leather cheap belts will be found in every low cost clothing store

Tiny one man bands often find it hard to identify their market and dont have the money to advertise, but just put up a very basic website and hope for the best. 

Customers got to shows or country fairs for many reasons not necessary to buy goods, but depending on the audience impulse buys can be high or low value goods, but high value are normally thought about products rather than impulse buy

Some leather workers don't want to keep making the same product day in day out others find it rewarding, the only rule is Time must be spent efficiently

Chrisash, you’ve  hit the nail on the head on all points.    

None of the questions can be really be answered in anything but a general way.    Outlets, prices, best thing to make, are all too variable, and with todays market, a one man/woman band selling around the world is almost the norm.

In most leatherwork, it’s the niche market which provides a reasonable income, small scale mass production gives a consistent income, one off customer personalised items (IMHO) provides most fun.

Building your market/customer base takes time, and a shortcut can’t really be provided by answering a few questions.    

I don’t want to discourage you, but also consider that if someone in your area is making a living selling a leather product, with the best will in the world, would they honestly be inclined to want to openly hand over their market to someone else.   If you discover that product/market through your own research, and start getting business from that, then more power to your elbow.

 

 

[Frodo]

8 hours ago, bryan4christ said:

I won't name any names but I've asked some of the "best" here on this site some simple questions and all I've gotten is crap   in response

Can somebody please tell me....

.....what leatherwork will bring in the highest rate of return?   I Live in Northern California.....

I have no idea what sells in your area,  That is a subject that you must figure out on your own

.....does handmade leatherwork sell for more or does it just take too much time?

Depends on your clientele,  Some ONLY want cheap,sweat shop $25.00 bags.  Others want quality,  AGAIN.  I have no idea about your area 

.....what outlets do you use to sell your leather goods?

I sell on the internet and locally via word of mouth

....I just need some honest straight forward answers

No one can tell you anything about the market in your area except people from your area. As far as what people want?  That also depends on your clients. are they lumberjacks?  who want chaps and ax covers?   gun owners who want holsters?  Find a swap meet and rent a booth. 

That is all the ""CRAP""  I have to offer

 

[Rhale]

Not only does it depend on what sells in your area the quality of your work will decide if your product will sell and for how much!  As everyone else has said what sells in my area probably won’t sell in California and visa versa.  Find out what sells where you are, make the highest quality product you can using the highest quality materials, price accordingly and if you have everything right it will sell, if it doesn’t then something you are doing isn’t right!  Product? Area? Quality? Price?

[Bert51]

I think you have received some very good advice from the posts above, the bottom line is there is no short cuts to your question, you need to work out what will work for you, for your customers in your area and the type of product you need to make will be dictated by the above advice.

Please don't feel no one wants to help you, but you need to help your self by making some things and seeing how they sell and how they are received by your customers, they will tell you real quick if it's not what they want. Put feelers out and talk to them.

Bert..

[chrisash]

One other thing, you have to be able to sell, but that does not mean it must be to the end customer

If say you enjoy making holsters (which seem to be the american thing) then work with your local gun shops, they tell you whats popular and buy what you make for them to sell on. this can be you give them a discounted price, so they can still make a good profit, or you supply them with a number of products which they sell and you give them a commission (no risk to the shop owner)

Washing and repairing Horse blankets may be a good way into repairing tack or selling your own tack if you have the skills required

Edited May 10, 2020 by chrisash

[Constabulary]

You seem to be a religious person so why not going this way? Figure what people like you (religious people) could use - like bible covers, bookmarks, belts, bracelets with religious symbols... Not really my world but I´m sure your community / church my be interested in certain leather products with religious symbols or psalms,  portrayals or what ever... You know better than I....

Just to give you an idea - check etsy:

https://www.etsy.com/market/christian_leather

https://www.etsy.com/market/religious_leather

But be careful with plain copying other peoples products... Develop your own distinctive products - maybe even interfaith leather goods. I´m sure in the US you have a more religious "streams" than we do but again you know better than I. So why not some Jewish influenced leather goods (decorated tefflins, kippa or so)

https://www.etsy.com/de/search?q=jewish leather

or maybe even something for the other religions (if your religion allows this).

 

EDIT:

BTW - you probably have chosen the wrong forum section for this question. The Member Gallery is not where I would expect a question like yours but maybe a moderator can put it in the right section (maybe The Business > Getting Started)

 

Edited May 10, 2020 by Constabulary

[Wykoni]

I am a very limited seller and producer of leather goods.  I know several of the people that has given you advice.  As all have said this is a tough business.  Like someone said holsters are common place items here in the U.S.  Those that are successful in this categories fall into two camps.  They are either very large, or very good.  I know saddlers in Texas that do beautiful work and are very successful, but not to the point where it’s totally there day jobs.  The big guys, have good prices, in some cases are a bit high but are almost totally automated, ie sewing machine, pattern cutting machines even to some cases power Bevelers. Time is money, and they reduce there time.  
I think you received the best advice, get out look around, see what sells, go to gun shows, see what leather goods are there, is it tooled or not....what are the prices, California gets better prices for stuff then let’s say Minot N.D.  There’s a lot of factors here, as Lumpendoodle said, find your niche.  Hope I have helped a little.  

[Alexis1234]

I answered and tried to be as helpful as I could in your personal messages.The rest of your questions I think have been answered- I wouldn't get into leather work for the money.  In my area, people don't want to spend $30 on a leather belt, let alone a leather tote or horse harness. I was told last summer at a show- it's a $25 leather bag.  I think your best bet is to go online and find a niche market offering items that are unique.  

[bryan4christ]

Alexis I did not mean you by any means.....

and to be honest I did not think anybody out there would even care enough or even bother to respond to me......

I didn't think anybody would even read what I had to say!  

The person I was talking with stated how "obvious" it was that  I was new to leatherwork and that I needed more experience before he/she would even answer my questions......it wasn't the first time this sort of thing has happened to me by respected sources here........I guess I took it too far.  

 

My apologies if I offended anybody.

[Constabulary]

I would not contact people by PM asking for a business idea. Thats what the forum is for and you for sure get more answers here than by PM - kinda crowd intelligence I´d say.

Starting a leather business when you come from zero (meaning w/o any skills) is probably a very hard way. It´s easier when you come from a hobby (and you are good at it / have developed certain skills) and then try to start a business. From zero to hero is very hard I´d say. Start making leather goods for you and your family & friends or your community (maybe even for free?) and ask for their "not sugar coated" opinion. And I tell you there is a lot of sugar coating. People often tend to say ooooh, thats so nice even when it´s not.

Edited May 11, 2020 by Constabulary

[Tugadude]

Suggest you go to the 'Marketing and Advertising' part of the forum.  Lots of interesting threads and good information there.  For example, this one from Johanna:

 

Regarding asking people for their advice, it doesn't surprise me that people in the business would be reluctant to share information.  Some are very generous while others (probably most) are more protective.  In my opinion, the leather business doesn't NEED any more leatherworkers.  What it does need is innovative companies providing quality goods.  Companies that move the ball down the field rather than walking over already trodden ground.  There has been an explosion of sorts in the "minimalist wallet" segment over the past few years.  What will be the "next big thing"?  Find it or create it and you just might find your niche.

If you're just going to make belts, bags and holsters, the market is flush with those already.

Just my opinion.

[eglideride]

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”

― Henry Ford

[lostcaggy]

The Mom Test: How to talk to customers & learn if your business is a good idea when everyone is lying to you

[chuck123wapati]

On 5/9/2020 at 8:34 PM, bryan4christ said:

I won't name any names but I've asked some of the "best" here on this site some simple questions and all I've gotten is crap in response

Can somebody please tell me....

.....what leatherwork will bring in the highest rate of return?   I Live in Northern California.....

.....does handmade leatherwork sell for more or does it just take too much time?

.....what outlets do you use to sell your leather goods?

....I just need some honest straight forward answers

Simple questions are vague questions. So answers are usually vague in reply."

....what leatherwork will bring in the highest rate of return?   I Live in Northern California....." Are you just going to sell in Northern California? Are you going to sell on line? are you going to advertise in magazines? Are you going to buy in bulk, do you  have the capitol to start a large business? work out of your garage and buy from Tandy?All these things affect your rate of return. How can someone answer you without more info? 

."....does handmade leatherwork sell for more or does it just take too much time?"   If you mean more time than mass produced then yes it takes more time to make, to much is a matter of how fast you are at making it, and usually sells for more than mass produced items unless it is crap workmanship then it doesn't sell at all. How long does it take you to build something compared to another leatherworker? People buy handmade for a reason and that reason is almost always quality and how fast you are at providing that quality also affects your rate of return. How can someone answer that without knowing the quality of your work?

".....what outlets do you use to sell your leather goods?" I use word of mouth, local advertising and consignment. BUT I'm not trying to make a living at this.

Those are as straightforward as I can get, My best advise to you if you are planning to make a viable living at this is to enroll in a college level business course and then with that knowledge you will be able to answer all your questions no matter what you decide to sell, you can then create a business plan that has a much better chance of success and understand better the nuances of the business world. Good luck to you!!!! 

 

[kiwican]

On 5/11/2020 at 10:10 AM, eglideride said:

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”

― Henry Ford

This is brilliant !

[Old Coach Saddlery]

Well crap. Lol

[KDR]

On 5/9/2020 at 10:34 PM, bryan4christ said:

I won't name any names but I've asked some of the "best" here on this site some simple questions and all I've gotten is crap in response

Can somebody please tell me....

.....what leatherwork will bring in the highest rate of return?   I Live in Northern California.....

.....does handmade leatherwork sell for more or does it just take too much time?

.....what outlets do you use to sell your leather goods?

....I just need some honest straight forward answers

First off, where you live is irrelevant.  The internet Kind of put a stop to postcode marketing.  If you want to make money through leatherworking, you need to increase your market range.  One of the things that doesn't often occur to people getting into leatherwork is that if you do your job well, the gear you make will last a lifetime.  Also, leather's a durable material that lends itself to repair.  Compare that to Walmart, where products are broken *before* you buy them, and people are just resigned to having to go out and buy the same thing again, because it's not worth fixing anything!  In a restricted market, you can hit saturation fairly quickly, plus people will often look to get leather stuff fixed, instead of scrapping it and starting again. A good leather belt will last decades.  There's a limit to how many you can sell to your immediate neighbours.

Sorry to be a bit facetious, but the leatherwork that brings in the highest rate of return will be the gear you can produce quickly at low cost and sell immediately into a vast, inflated market.  I've seen beautiful leather buckets, but that's probably not what you need to hear!  There is no single answer to this question, it comes down to what you know, what you can make, and how well you can sell.  Buy low, sell high. If you can.

The word handmade gives your work some cachet, for what it's worth.  Lots of people do care about that and will pay more for it, but I'd say most don't.  That's fine, most people won't be your customers anyway.  You set your price and you make your case for your price.  This costs this much because of this this and this.  You can leave it to your kids, even grand kids, because it will still do its job in fifty, sixty years.  This is the price because it's not just Some Product.  It's a product of your creativity and expertise. Because it has been tailored to your customer's exact requirements.  Handmade can be strong.  It does cost more, and it does take more time, but it can work if you hit your niche.  A globalised niche is a massive market. Be online, be visible.  We make our customers wait for custom pieces.  First, we have to, because there are only two of us working, and second because the stuff takes time.  We find people are happy to wait for something they know will be good, will be just what they want.  Anticipation is the best sauce.

If you want to go handmade and make money, stay away from wholesale.  Go to the end user and you will be able to charge double what a store will pay you.  The store isn't trying to rob you, they just have costs they need to build into their price, just like you do.  Work the internet. The internet is made for fake news, social aggression and niche craft leatherworkers.  

Hope this helps, and good luck

[Retswerb]

@KristinaDRawlings thanks for this response, these are good words for many of us who periodically consider trying to turn our hobby into more of a money maker.

@bryan4christ, you’ve gotten a lot of good feedback here. The one thing I haven’t seen asked in response is... are you any good at leather working? I’m not trying to be confrontational, but it seems to me the answer to each of your questions depends fairly heavily on your skill level and what you’re able to produce. I don’t think you’ve shown any of your work here, although I may have missed it. If you’re still listening here, show this community your products and you’ll get much more helpful answers.

[Hardrada]

11 hours ago, Retswerb said:

The one thing I haven’t seen asked in response is... are you any good at leather working? I’m not trying to be confrontational, but it seems to me the answer to each of your questions depends fairly heavily on your skill level and what you’re able to produce.

Not being confrontational either, but Retswerb statement brought to mind something I'd like to offer as humble advice: it's easier to craft good looking goods by starting in a niche you're familiar with. Case in point: I'm into tobacco pipes; thus, some of my early projects were pipe-related leather goods: pouches. I bought Nigel Armitage pouch pattern pack and modified one of the designs. Made a prototype; shewed it around to other pipe smokers; it garnered some interest; I got commissions. The last bloke who bought one surprised me in days past by showcasing it around on a pipe forum, and saying I have mad skills. I really don't, but to the end customer you'll have mad skills if the product looks relatively well-crafted, detailed, and finished: stitches as straight and consistent as possible (quite doable nowadays in the era of stitching chisels—I couldn't do that with pricking irons and awl), and well burnished edges are paramount. Then there's the design.

Because I'm a pipe smoker, I know what's most needed in a pouch and where it should be placed, and what are the optimal dimensions that would allow it to accommodate pipes of different shapes and lengths. The design of that pouch was praised too: "everything at the top, within easy reach" was one comment.

Now, I'm not trying to praise myself: point in fact, I've posted that pouch here and other leatherworkers, more experienced and knowledgeable, immediately caught imperfections and suggested improvements. Notes taken. My next stop was the local tobacconist: pouches aren't that popular there, but he's been ordering pipe rests like hot cakes. These rests are easy to make from scrap leather (English bridle bellies) which would be wasted otherwise. Again: I go through 'the trouble' of finishing the edges on these (Edge Kote and Tokonole) and burnishing the flesh side if it's too flakey: it takes time, but it guarantees a good looking item that will encourage further sales.

My point is: by starting with something I'm familiar with I already have the advantage of some knowledge and a potential market. From there, I can diversify. And so forth: there are other niches I'm into as well, so now I'm crafting items for those too. We'll see how it goes.

Edited May 26, 2020 by Hardrada

[bryan4christ]

On 5/25/2020 at 6:54 PM, KristinaDRawlings said:

First off, where you live is irrelevant.  The internet Kind of put a stop to postcode marketing.  If you want to make money through leatherworking, you need to increase your market range.  One of the things that doesn't often occur to people getting into leatherwork is that if you do your job well, the gear you make will last a lifetime.  Also, leather's a durable material that lends itself to repair.  Compare that to Walmart, where products are broken *before* you buy them, and people are just resigned to having to go out and buy the same thing again, because it's not worth fixing anything!  In a restricted market, you can hit saturation fairly quickly, plus people will often look to get leather stuff fixed, instead of scrapping it and starting again. A good leather belt will last decades.  There's a limit to how many you can sell to your immediate neighbours.

Sorry to be a bit facetious, but the leatherwork that brings in the highest rate of return will be the gear you can produce quickly at low cost and sell immediately into a vast, inflated market.  I've seen beautiful leather buckets, but that's probably not what you need to hear!  There is no single answer to this question, it comes down to what you know, what you can make, and how well you can sell.  Buy low, sell high. If you can.

The word handmade gives your work some cachet, for what it's worth.  Lots of people do care about that and will pay more for it, but I'd say most don't.  That's fine, most people won't be your customers anyway.  You set your price and you make your case for your price.  This costs this much because of this this and this.  You can leave it to your kids, even grand kids, because it will still do its job in fifty, sixty years.  This is the price because it's not just Some Product.  It's a product of your creativity and expertise. Because it has been tailored to your customer's exact requirements.  Handmade can be strong.  It does cost more, and it does take more time, but it can work if you hit your niche.  A globalised niche is a massive market. Be online, be visible.  We make our customers wait for custom pieces.  First, we have to, because there are only two of us working, and second because the stuff takes time.  We find people are happy to wait for something they know will be good, will be just what they want.  Anticipation is the best sauce.

If you want to go handmade and make money, stay away from wholesale.  Go to the end user and you will be able to charge double what a store will pay you.  The store isn't trying to rob you, they just have costs they need to build into their price, just like you do.  Work the internet. The internet is made for fake news, social aggression and niche craft leatherworkers.  

Hope this helps, and good luck

Thank You SO MUCH......

 

[wayner]

There use to be a guy on here that sells tooled belts for over $400.00 so it depends on your skill level, what you make , and your customers.