Handstitch vs Machine for artisan pieces

[PastorBob]

It also depends on how much you are willing to shell out for a sewing machine.  I was pricing electric machines, used, for around $900 and up.  A really nice machine can run you several thousand.  For that kind of money ($1000), at $10 an hour for labor, would equate to 100 hours of hand sewing.  I have been hand sewing for 4 years and have not come close to 100 hours.  But I am just a hobbyist, hoping to sell some to pay for my next leather / dye / tool purchase.  I am mostly going into the hole though.  The main thing is, I enjoy developing new patterns, watching other artisans via YT or in person, and of course, creating something new, whether for myself or a friend or loved one and seeing their smiles and appreciation.

[tsunkasapa]

24 minutes ago, PastorBob said:

It also depends on how much you are willing to shell out for a sewing machine.  I was pricing electric machines, used, for around $900 and up.  A really nice machine can run you several thousand.  For that kind of money ($1000), at $10 an hour for labor, would equate to 100 hours of hand sewing.  I have been hand sewing for 4 years and have not come close to 100 hours.  But I am just a hobbyist, hoping to sell some to pay for my next leather / dye / tool purchase.  I am mostly going into the hole though.  The main thing is, I enjoy developing new patterns, watching other artisans via YT or in person, and of course, creating something new, whether for myself or a friend or loved one and seeing their smiles and appreciation.

I agree 100%. I HAVE a sewing machine, but I have never used it , other than a place to pile things. I enjoy handsewing, I think it looks better, and I think it is stronger. And as for my 'time', I'm old, retired and I don't GAF about time any more. I have many other things that are more important.

[chuck123wapati]

5 hours ago, Warhauk said:

Thanks for all the advice. I was honestly leaning toward machine stitching because I don't think I would get much enjoyment from my projects while doing them, just knowing I was going to hunker down after to hand stitch for hours to finish the project. My biggest concern was for the projects that already take a lot of time and work. 

Just an example with completely made up numbers (because I don't know currently know pricing or the market or how long things take)

Say I made a really nice saddle and it took me 60 hours with all the carving and detailing involved, not including any stitching. If I value my time at say $10/hr, using some formula that is supposedly a good starting point for prices, (material cost + labor cost) x4 for retail work, I would be charging roughly $2400 at that point. That is ignoring material cost. Now if I took an additional 10 hours to hand stitch it, that would put the cost about $3200.

If I machine stitched it in 1 hour, the price in theory would be $2440.

I'm sure there are a lot of other variables, but in general, would this be the case, $2440 vs $3200 or is it not actually proportional. Like would you actually be charging a lower rate for your time for the hand stitching, or maybe the machine sewing would make the saddle worth even less bc people want their high end artisan pieces to be hand sewn. 

As chrisash said, I'm probably just overthinking it, but it's those nuances that interest me sometimes.

Stitching is part of the process its not separate in any way. Hand stitching when learned and done correctly isn't tedious or hard to do imo but it sure was before i knew how. In fact it makes a guy feel good to see the personal improvement just as any of the processes are plus there are some things that the average machine cant sew. If you plan on being competitive with Walmart's products neither will help you. If you plan on being competitive with other crafters with sewing machines then you will need a lot of practice some are veeery fast and time learning the machine is part of it also! If you plan on being competitive with hand stitching you still have to say its machine sewn, that's an apples and oranges argument.

As with all tools there is cost in purchase, maintenance  and time learning that needs to be included in the final cost of each product so you have to add that just as you would the extra time hand stitching. 

"I'm new to the entire concept of leatherworking and am looking into buying the basic equipment I need to get started."   A leather sewing machine isn't basic equipment imo and i'm sorry to say but only friends or family would buy your first few saddles, folks who go out looking to buy them want guaranteed quality from well  known makers.

[RockyAussie]

10 hours ago, Spyros said:

Machine stitching is definitely the way if you're aiming for a profit, but it can also be beautiful and durable if you invest time and money.

So true. What will sell products is how well you design and make the product. Very very few will fail because of it being machine sewn. Other factors in design though can make a big difference and educating people on why your product is better than other products on offer is every bit as important as your actual skill in making the product. First thing a customer wants is something that will Last,second thing is the workmanship quality of the manufacturing and these days where  it was made, what country.

[Spyros]

27 minutes ago, RockyAussie said:

So true. What will sell products is how well you design and make the product. Very very few will fail because of it being machine sewn. Other factors in design though can make a big difference and educating people on why your product is better than other products on offer is every bit as important as your actual skill in making the product. First thing a customer wants is something that will Last,second thing is the workmanship quality of the manufacturing and these days where  it was made, what country.

Absolutely.  And they want to be able to explain it to the next person who asks them about it and be able to justify the purchase to themselves first and foremost.  Made in Australia makes people feel better, knowing a bit about the person who made it makes it even easier.  At the end of the day it's all in the mind, people buy a perception more than a product.

By the way you have some awesome new stuff on your website lately

Great photography too

Edited November 4, 2021 by Spyros

[Hags]

Arthritis, cobra class 3....

[Warhauk]

On 11/3/2021 at 3:24 PM, PastorBob said:

It also depends on how much you are willing to shell out for a sewing machine.  I was pricing electric machines, used, for around $900 and up.  A really nice machine can run you several thousand.  For that kind of money ($1000), at $10 an hour for labor, would equate to 100 hours of hand sewing.  I have been hand sewing for 4 years and have not come close to 100 hours.  But I am just a hobbyist, hoping to sell some to pay for my next leather / dye / tool purchase.  I am mostly going into the hole though.  The main thing is, I enjoy developing new patterns, watching other artisans via YT or in person, and of course, creating something new, whether for myself or a friend or loved one and seeing their smiles and appreciation.

I happen to have a decent sewing machine (with that being said, it supposedly works with leather but it isnt specifically for it and im not necessarily convinced without doing the research first). My wife wanted one of the fancy ones for both sewing and embroidery a couple years back.

Thank you all for your input. Hopefully I will end up finding the hand stitching rewarding, whether that is the route I go or not. Still waiting on my stuff to come in so i can start to get a few for it.

[HandyDave]

I enjoy hand stitching and find it very rewarding. But i mostly do holsters and small bags and mostly just made to order so no production. But even with making several of the same item for  production runs. You can speed things up even with the hand stitching and tooling. By doing small things like cutting a bunch of patterns out at one time speacially if you cut them by machine like a clicker press. And if you are doing several of the same thing you find a rhythm after a few pieces and they go together alot quicker. One of few things i make several of is can coozies for flea market sales and such. There all cut by hand tooled and hand sewn. Ill cut 20 or so out at a time tool them all then sew them all. And theres not alot of stitching on a can coozie but after the first couple i can stitch one up in about 5 minutes. And since your just starting into leather like has allready been said practice your fundamentals and practice some more then worry about trying to sell.

[Spyros]

I'm actually considering a sewing machine at the moment, but there's just no way I will ever stop handstitching entirely, I enjoy too much both the process and how it looks.  It's just that for some specific things I'm struggling to justify the time, for example I made a belt for myself over the weekend and that was hours and hours of stitching along the length of the belt, and back, which is a standard job that any machine would do in seconds, and I don't know if handstitching actually added anything to the result in this instance.

One thing I'm struggling with is if you make both handstitched and machine-stitched products, how do you keep any sort of visual consistency between the two, given that machine thread is usually thinner and different type than handstitching thread.  Just one of the many technical issues I have to think about before investing any money. 

[Handstitched]

@Spyros I hear ya.

I bought my Juki  clone back in 2005 . It was around $3800 from Qld.  , but to replace it now would be around the $5000 + mark .  And although its done so much and  pretty much paid for itself now, ( and I claim depreciation when I do my tax) , I still hand stitch. I will never give that up .  There are many projects/ jobs I do that  need the handstitching .  I think I spoke about this on another thread. So I'm 50/50 when it comes to machine V's hand stitching.  At the end of the day, I'm happy with my decision to buy a heavy  duty sewing machine. 

 

A bit of trivia: I fully handstitched an item for our local  Ag Show( it was a cartridge belt) , and while it got  the ' Best in Section' blue ribbon, I'm happy to say , the judge thought it was machine stitched. Go figure ? 

HS