Wizcrafts

There is also Greg at Keystone sewing machines. They have new and used machines. I'll have to look them up to get a phone number. Techsew, a division of Raphael Sewing in Montreal, PQ, also sells used machine and is a member of this forum. There are actually a lot of new machine dealers that also rebuild older stock. I am sure you will find a suitable machine at a price you can afford.

You'll probably need a cylinder arm machine, with a walking foot mechanism, to do the work you described. A couple of our member-dealers sell used, as well as new leather sewing machines. The one I know best is Bob Kovar, owner of Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines (in Toledo, Ohio). He has dozens of new and used/rebuilt machines of all descriptions for sale, including many that have cylinder arms. His phone number is 866-362-7397. If you are in the market for a new machine, your choices expand, along with the cost.

I am posting this for a business associate of mine, who has a custom leathercraft shop in Flint, Michigan. He is selling his well maintained and highly improved Randall Model 132 strap cutter. The machine was purchased new from Randall, in New York, in 1990. He had it modified by a local machine shop to have heavy duty bearings and grease fittings on the main shafts, ensuring that the shafts will not run dry or go out of round, under the stress of cutting thick leather into straps. The machine originally shipped with one set of blades and spacers. He required more widths of cut and purchased or had manufactured 45 spacers in 4 widths and 4 new blade spacer plates for them. He also purchased about 45 additional type 132 cutting blades, from Randall. The asking price is $4250. The machine is clean, setup and can be tested in the shop. More details and lots of photos of the machine, motor-table and the many extra parts are available on this web page. Anybody interested in viewing or purchasing the Randall 132 strap cutter should call Doug Monroe, at M&M Leather: 810-732-4907, Monday - Saturday, from noon until 6 PM, Eastern Time. This is a cash and carry offer, from Flint, Michigan.

Let the discussion begin! Art has already mentioned the Cobra stitchers, which are based in California. They are great machines. But, nobody has mentioned Cowboy stitchers yet. Cowboy stitchers are of equal quality and similar specifications to the Cobras. The Cowboy CB2500 (10.5" arm), CB3500 (9" arm), CB4500 (16.5" arm) and CB5500 (25" arm) are sold and supported by Bob Kovar, at Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines: 866-362-7397. They will sew all the holsters you can throw at them, with thread heavy enough to tie a bale of hay. For pancake holsters, 1/4 inch in total thickness, well molded to the shape of the gun, I would use #207 or #277 bonded nylon thread. To sew these thread sizes you need to use a #24 or #25 needle. You are correct: you definitely want a lockstitch machine! Almost all sewing machines in general use are lockstitch machines. This is used to lock the starting and finishing stitches in place and prevent the work from coming undone. By sewing backwards into the same holes, for about three stitches, you lock the thread in place. You can also sew backwards, or turn the holster around, sewing a parallel stitch line for about 3/4 inch. This system is used by commercial holster manufacturers. The three machines I mentioned are capable of sewing 1/2" (CB2500) and 7/8" (CB3500 and CB4500 models). The 2500 is bottom feed only and can leave tooth marks on the bottom. The others are compound feed, with a smooth feed dog that leaves no tooth marks. If you want to just sew holsters and belts, the 9 inch arm machines will do just fine. They all sew with very heavy thread and big needles, into dense leather, up to 7/8" thick. The CB2500 has a 10 1/2 inch long arm and the 4500 has a 16.5" arm length. If you ever sew a Western holster you will appreciate the longer arm on the CB4500. They do have table top attachments if you need a flat surface to support the work.

I would agree 100%, but the OP specifically said he wanted to stay away from Chinese built machines. That's why I limited my response to US, Japanese and German built machines. He also asked about the American built Campbell machines. I my humble opinion, there is no other harness/holster sewing machine in production that can equal the stitch quality of a Campbell-Randall or Union Lockstitch machine. I have used Union Lockstitch machines to produce hundreds of holsters, belts and pouches over the years, including the holsters used in the movie Romeo and Juliet. Freedman Harness has a floor full of Randalls, working day in and day out, making harness, bridles and reins for the Rockerfellers and other top equestrian businesses and breeders. A few years ago, Bianci had Campbell-Randall machines producing most of their holsters, pouches, and Sam Browne belts for Police, security, sporting and military use. In the hands of a skilled operator, nothing beats a Campbell-Randall or Union Lockstitch machine for stitch quality, tightness, and top/bottom appearance. Very few other machines can sew with liquid waxed linen thread either. Just my 2 cents worth! Now, if the OP wants to ask about Chinese built machines, I'll be glad to discuss them.

1894leverguy; I understand that you intend to sew two pieces of veg-tan leather into pancake holsters, belts and straps, not exceeding 1/4" thickness. What you haven't stated is the size of thread you want to use. This will determine the basic type of machine you will need; not just the thickness. If you can accept a maximum thread size of #138, a Japanese built Juki LU-1508 or Consew 206RB-(number) sewing machine will do the trick. These machines and other Japanese clones will sew over 3/8" with #138 thread, top and bottom. Note, that the most current Consew, the 206RB-5, is now built in China. If you want a non-Chinese built machine, look for a good used, or unsold 206RB-4. Adler makes flatbed and cylinder arm machines. But, the current crop are mostly built in China. You will have to poll the dealers to see who has a German built Adler. Pfaff are excellent German machines. They have walking foot machines that will sew over 1/4", some with #138 thread. As for the 100 RPM maximum motor speed, that is up to what options are available from the seller. If you purchase a machine with a low-speed capable servo motor and 2" pulley, you're set. Otherwise, you'll need to replace the motor with a true slow speed capable servo motor, or a 2" pulley and speed reducer on a clutch motor. Be aware that not all servo motors will sew at speeds below 100 RPM. If you get one of those motors and try sewing at 1 stitch per second, it may drop out and fight you. Those motors have very little slow speed torque. I have a SewPro 500GR gear reduction servo motor, with a 50mm pulley, on my Japanese National 300N walking foot machine, and it will sew from the speed of grass growing, all the way up to 1500 rpm (after motor to flywheel reduction, about 600 stitches per minute, max.). As to Campbell-Randall, it is the best stitcher you can buy, but is not really for beginners. It is a needle and awl machine that lives in a world of its own. You would do best to learn to sew on a walking foot machine first. If you decide to buy a Campbell, you should go get it in person and take some time to learn how to operate, adjust and maintain it, at the factory in Yoakum Texas.

Since you're in Canada why don't you contact Raphael Sewing/Techsew, in Montreal? There are also several industrial sewing machine dealers in Toronto. They can cross-reference your Naka to a Juki or Seiko part number and get you sewing in a few days, via C.P. If they can't find a matching part (unlikely they can't), Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines may be able to match that spring.

I sew at work on a Cobra Class 4 heavy stitcher, which is equipped with a servo motor containing a digital speed readout and up/down speed buttons. Since the machine arrived in late-January I have struggled with trying to get it to sew steadily at very slow speeds, without dialing it way down to its minimum top speed (useless on long runs). Also, it was very difficult to turn the flywheel by hand, to single stitch around belt tips, or pre-position the needle before entering a previously made hole (doing repairs). This morning I was talking to Steve, at Cobra, and told him about this problem. He suggested that I try loosening the belt going from the speed reducer to the machine and also the motor to reducer belt. The reducer is bolted to a slot in a side post on the frame and can be moved up and down, to tension the upper belt. The motor has a threaded rod with nuts above and below a tang on the motor. Raising the position of the tang loosens the motor belt and vice-versa. Both of the belts on our machine were very tight and had minimal deflection in their middle areas (under 3/8"). Today, we loosened both belts slightly (to ~1/2" light touch deflection) and I am here to tell you that it made a big improvement! It is now easier to obtain and maintain slow speeds (~1/second), before the motor drops out. Furthermore, it is also easier to hand wheel for single stitches, or to position the needle where I want it to line up. Mind you, the hand wheel is still loaded by the motor and nowhere near as easy to turn as a machine hooked up to a clutch motor. This is a no cost solution for anybody who has a big sewing machine with a speed reducer between the motor and machine. It has benefits to the motor, reducer and machine, in that it reduces the strain on the bearings. You just have to make sure you don't loosen either belt so much that it slips when you sew dense or very thick leather. There is a sweet spot and you can find it with a little experimentation. If your work is always medium temper leather you can probably loosen the belts even more, before slippage occurs. A good belt dressing can give better grip, at less belt tension. Happy sewing to all and to all a good night!

I just read your edit. If you can sew the seats hanging down on the left end of the machine, a shorter cylinder arm machine will work for you. There are a bunch of 9 inch long cylinder arm machines on the market. They will sew with very thick thread and huge needles, have very large bobbins and come with servo motors and can sew from 1/16" up to 7/8" of leather. Called 441 clones, these 9" arm walking foot machines sell for between $1500 to $2000, depending on the brand and how badly they want to move that type of machine. The same machines are also available in 16.5" arm and 25" arm lengths, but for more money ($2500 and up). If you want brand names, PM me.

If you want a sewing machine that can handle thread as thick as the type used for hand sewing, you are not going to find it for much under $1000. If a seat is 13 inches long at the longest point to be sewn, you'll need a work space at least that long on the right side of the machine. Of the machines commonly available, only a few have more than a foot inside the body. One type is a long arm show patcher. These machines have an 18 inch long snout, that is really narrow at the left end and gets wider as you move to the right. The work is entirely moved by the pressor foot, which has teeth on the bottom and can be turned 360 degrees, by means of thumb paddles under the head. The bottom cover plate has a hole large enough for a big needle on one end and a narrower needle on the other end. The bobbins on this particular machine are about 1/4" x 3/4" and are best loaded with #69 or #92 thread. You can use #138 thread on top, with a #21, or #22 needle (maybe even a #20). I have tried to thread #138 into a #19 patcher needle but it won't go through the eye. Patchers like this, mounted onto a cast iron treadle base, typically sell for between $800 to $1200 used. The machine and base weigh in at about 200 pounds. If you want to sew with heavier than #138 thread, look for a harness stitcher and triple your budget.

You'll need one hell of a post machine to do all of those projects, especially the assembled seats. I'll look over some specs and see if anything presents itself as a heavy duty post sewing machine. They are usually used to sew moccasins, ball and biker caps, shoe uppers, etc. I've even sewn cowboy hats on old post machines. However, they used really thin #69 thread and had roller feet that barely allowed 1/4" to be sewn. Newer post machines may have a walking foot that possibly allows up to 3/8" thickness and #92 or 138 thread. Otherwise, a heavy duty cylinder arm machine, perhaps with a raised throat plate, will be required. How thick is the leather, at the thickest point, when you sew it together? What is the thinness of the suspenders? What size thread are you using? Can you tolerate tooth marks on the bottom side? How deep of an open space do you need to the right of the needle? How much can you afford to spend on a machine?

My friend's Cobra Class 4 does the same thing. We set it to the stitch length we need for various thicknesses. We also change stitch length for effect. It is not set in stone. I can tell you with certainty that if you remove the regular throat plate and feed dog, and replace them with the slotted plate, that you will lose about 25% or more of the set stitch length in forward, and maybe more in reverse. That was my finding a few weeks ago when I tried that. I think a teflon strip taped onto the throat plate might help reduce the loss of stitch length from friction with the slotted plate. I think that perhaps my recommendation about loosening both top and bottom thread tensions will help al lot when sewing tall leather loads. With less bobbin pressure a smaller needle size could be used and would still be able to pull the knots well up into the layers. The smaller needle exhibits less friction going in and out of the leather. With less friction on the way up, the top pressure spring can be backed off, making it easier for the machine to feed stitches of any length.

A pendulum always swings farther at the bottom, than higher up its shaft. Most modern sewing machines, including all of the 205 and 441 type machines, work on the pendulum needlebar principle. They pivot at the top, in an arc that is by nature longer at the bottom than up the bar. Once the needle penetrates all of the leather layers and begins to move them, the distance higher up must be shorter than if there were only a couple of layers to move. It may not be what you wanted to hear, but it is backed up by science. Most upholstery class machines don't sew over 3/8" of anything, so the stitch length variance is less noticeable (but present). That is no longer the case when you move up to 3/4 inch. You must lengthen the stitch length adjuster to compensate for the variation when changing from 1/4" to 3/4". Here are possible workarounds that you might be want to try out, in the hopes of getting the least variation in stitch length from thin to thick leather. First, make sure that the feed dog is set to its highest position as it moves the work. It can only go so high before it makes contact with the underside of the throat plate. Next, try backing off the top pressure on the pressor feet. You can only back off so far before the leather raises with the ascending needle and thread. Your machine doesn't have individual springs for the inside and outside feet, so one upper pressure adjustment serves both feet. Try going up or down one needle size. A thicker needle won't flex as much as a thinner one, but requires more pressure to hold the leather down. A thinner needle penetrates the leather easier, but the knots may not be pulled up as easily. Reduce the top and bobbin spring tensions equally. Less top and bottom tension makes it easier for the mechanism to feed the thick material. Spray or wipe silicon or Teflon lube on the throat plate under the leather to reduce friction on the bottom. There are sewing machines that don't exhibit the change in stitch length with changes in thickness. I own such a machine (ULS), but it is not for the faint-hearted. Such machines have what is known as square drive. This is not found in most sewing machines, as it is more complicated and expensive to implement than a pivoting pendulum needlebar. Square drive machines sell for more used than you paid for your new CB3500.

Do I read correctly that you want a sewing machine to make motorcycle seats? Are you certain that a flatbed machine will work properly?

If the machine and motor are in pristine condition, maybe $500. There would have to be a boatload of bobbins, needles and thread to make it worth that much. Otherwise, the machine and motor are probably worth no more than $350. If you find that you can't control the clutch motor you can buy a brand new variable speed servo motor for under $200 shipped. But, first try replacing the pulley with the smallest one you can find. A 2" pulley is plenty slow. You'll probably need a shorter v-belt for the smaller pulley.

He has no website at this time. Bob has a website but not an online shopping cart. Call Bob Kovar, at: 866-362-7397 to order needles for your machine.

The big wheel on the back and sliding plate on the front suggest that this machine may be a tacker of some fashion; perhaps an X pattern tacker. Tackers only do one thing: lay down a tight patterned stitch, according to the design of the cutouts in the drive wheel. If this machine is an X tacker, it will only sew X shaped patterns in material that is clamped onto the sliding plate. Each stroke of the foot pedal will initiate on complete tacking pattern. Tackers are used to attach straps, Velcro, webbing, name tags, etc., to other pieces of material.

The Rex 26-188 is a clone of the Singer 16-188 and is identical to the Consew 18. If you find somebody who has pressor feet for the Singer 16-188, or Consew 18, they will fit the Rex. Have you called Toledo Industrial Sewing Machines yet? They have all manner of pressor feet, feed dogs, parts and accessories for most makes and clones of industrial sewing machines.

It might be able to hem Plonge leather garments (cuffs, hems), but is really meant for cloth. If you are asking if this machine will "sew" leather, as in wallets, vests, belts, holsters, absolutely NOT. It is a tailoring machine, used for hems and cuffs on shirts, pants and dresses.

My buddy just sold his last month. It was good for 16 to 18 ounces of leather, with a #22 needle and #138 thread. The only problem was the pressor feet had teeth on the bottom. It made serious marks in veg-tan leather, but pulled leather through like a tractor.

A Singer 111G in good condition should not sell for much more than $300 to $350. If it is in mint condition, maybe $500. If poor condition, $200. These are now very old machines, but parts are plentiful and not too expensive. Do kick its tires, with your leather and the thickest thread they or you have. It should be able to sew with #138 thread, with a #22 or #23 needle, through 5/16" of belt leather. All of those machines shipped with clutch motors, usually 1/2 horsepower. If the machine was sold to an upholstery shop, it probably has a 3.5 or 4 inch motor pulley. This will not be easy to control at slower speeds required for sewing leather. You can buy a 2" or 2 1/4" replacement pulley and a shorter v-belt online, or from our dealers, for about $20 shipped (for both). A dealer can help you decide what size belt you'll need, after you tell him what is on the motor now. Or, you can save a lot of hassles and buy a SewPro 500GR like I use and have perfect speed control from zero to 1500 rpm.

I do sew thick and thin projects and have machines geared towards those extremes. At work, I sew on an Adler long arm motorized patcher and a Cobra Class 4 cylinder arm machine. At home I have a National walking foot machine, a Singer long arm patcher and a Union Lockstitch harness stitcher. Each does certain things better that the others. But, you asked my opinion for one machine that will do it all. Okay. Collars are worn around animal's necks and should be pre-curved when sewn. Purses have shapes that may or may not need to hang down, below the left edge of the machine. This suggests a cylinder arm machine. I'm not sure how thick your collars or purses will be, but when it comes to a sewing machine for leather, more is better than less. I'd buy a machine that could sew thicker that what I have in mind now, but still sew thin leather. Then, if you decide to sew holsters and sheathes, you will have enough machine to do the job. Since you asked what "I would buy," the answer is a Cowboy or Cobra cylinder arm, compound feed machine, with a servo motor that can run below 60 rpm and possibly, a speed reducer pulley. I am personally familiar with both. Either brand will sew from 4 ounces (using a #18 or #19 needle and #69 or #92 thread), up to about 7/8", with a #27 needle and #415 thread. If your collars will never exceed 3/8", you could get the job done with a "227" type machine. These are based on the ancient Singer 153 types. They have a 10.5" cylinder arm, about 2 1/2" in diameter and a triple feed walking foot system that allows you to sew right up to the left edge of the machine. Using the common series 135x16 or 135x17 needles, you can sew with thread sizes 46, up to 138 on these machines. They can be converted to sew a little thicker material, but not with much heavier thread than #138. I hope this helps. You are welcome to PM me if you have more specific questions about these machines.

That Pfaff 463 is a very high speed, flat foot, bottom feed, garment machine. It can be used for sewing soft, but not sticky leather with thin thread. You would need a roller foot conversion to sew sticky leather, and would need to slow it way down. But, it will probably not be the right machine for belts. The Singer 111 with a walking foot will sew everything you mentioned. You can buy a small 2" pulley if it runs to fast for you.

Babbs; You quoted me but didn't type a reply! Please try again.

You're right; #138 is too thick for your garment overlays. #69 or #92 thread will be fine. If you will be making sharp turns, get the smaller roller foot (set). The big wheel is more for long straight runs. A roller foot on the left allows you a complete view of the tracing lines and the needle. You cannot get a more accurate system for following drawn stitch lines. Just keep the work lamp on the right side of the front, to avoid casting a shadow of the roller.