bruce johnson

Clay, I am a witness, I was there. In the philosophical discussion of headgear (before we ended up in the bar), it was pointed out that some people were wearing hats backwards, or had generic creases that could be worn front or back with equal views. It was discussed that Charley wore his properly. I would be a bit careful picking on Charley. I know he has the bladeware now. A Dozier head knife, small head knife, and a fixed blade. I LIKE your hat Charley!!! No need for a tie breaker, Jesse Smith said he liked it too, and another vote for wearing it properly. I forgot another one. I saw Kevin Willey at the SLO affair too.

Curt, Ben Cox shared this formula with us a while back. I think Ben's formula is 1-1/2 cups water, 1/2 cup lexol conditioner. and 1 tbsp of baby shampoo. I mix it by the quart - 3 parts water, 1 part lexol, squirt of baby shampoo. I have been using this for a few months now, and am just as happy as the first time. Still no mold in the shop (knocking on wood).

I'm planning on going. I have talked to Dennis on the phone, he was here, and we got together in Sheridan before the show. I have learned something new or a different aspect of using the cards each time I have seen these guys.

Winding down from Sheridan. In no particular order sort of. Before we left, we had a nice visit at home with Dennis Lane, David Morris, and Hank Strathan on their way through to Sheridan. Ryan Cope came over and we spent the better part of the day BSing. We started off on Monday visiting Clay Miller in Rapid City. He suggested that we visit Ken Nelson's shop there too, and probably spent about 5 hours BSing there. Enjoyable time, and a good set of old Hamley's on display in his shop. We met up with Russell Millar and his dad Chuck for supper the next night in Spearfish SD, and a good 3 plus hours of BSing there too. (Seeing the trend here?) Got into Sheridan and visited Barry King and then Vandy and Luke at Sheridan Leather Outfitters right off the bat. Met Doug Classan and Wayne Christenson, Kathy Flanagan, Bob Goudreault, and then the Australian contigent again that night. Ran into Richard Hidalgo, Elton Joorisity, Rod and Denise Nikkel, Steve Mason, and others. Met up with Paul Brinegar and Paul Zelasek at Paul's booth. Rundi and I both thoroughly enjoyed the trip, and the good friendships we made there. If I missed mentioning anyone, I am sorry. If you were there and we missed you, sorry about that too. It was great to put some faces with names, and renew old friendhsips again. Thanks to all for your hospitality. I can't believe I forgot this guy who was there. We thoroughly enjoyed hanging out with Charley "Three Dozier Knives" Bay.

Andy, Welcome to our little corner of the world. Feel free to go back through past topics and add anything to them you see. Nothing closes around here. I would also suggest others checking out your website. Andy is a talent and talented instructor also. I took his class last year at the Elko leather show. I was just out of the thumb brace, hadn't used a swivel knife for 2 months prior, and had some problems with that. The instruction was top notch and once I got home, everything fell into place and my work took another step up the ladder. If anyone gets a chance to take his class, I would sure recommend it.

Shorts, I have handsewn and machine sewn through gallons of Barge. I have not seen what you are talking about. Barge dries to a pretty flexible bond, and has never been a problem sewing for me. On freshly glued pieces, the only thing I ever see is glue boogers forming on the machine needles if I didn't use thread lube. I would try sewing a scrap of two peces of whatever you are sewing without the glue - just clamp them and sew a short section. My suspicion is not the Barge but a an awl or leather issue.

Crystal, Another good sharpening book is How To Sharpen Leather Tools by Herb French. It costs about $10, and Sheridan Leather Outfitters have it. It goes into some of the specifics for leather tools, and especially working on older tools that might have a pitted or dinged up edge. Herb has some good advice for power or hand sharpening. Like Steve, I use the leather wheels. I also use cratex wheels on the dremel too for more aggressive metal removing. The big key for all of this is preserving the correct angle for the tool. If you do much work from the top of the french edger like Stohlman shows, you can raise that angle up. I mostly work flat off the bottom for my FEs, and strop the top with the cloth wheels or the leather wheels if I need to get some hone marks out. I used to consider the lower end tools as almost disposibles. After a few times they never sharpened up right. Most of that was the design of the edgers and difficulty to visualize the top edge down in that slot. The sharpening angle also seemed to be quite a lot higher than what I am using now. The biggest problem was they never were quite sharp when new, so I am sure that I wasn't starting with as good an edge as I could do now either. The more open pattern edger like the round bottoms, vizzard pattern, or bisonettes are easier for me to keep a good edge on with the least effort. They work up as easy as a french edger for me. The prices are higher, but like Tazz said, some people just find it easier to toss a cheaper one and replace it with the same. Throw away about 4 cheap ones, and ruin one project and figure the time and material cost in it before you wrecked it and started over. Makes a $55-80 edger pretty realistic if you use them enough. I finally started replacing the sizes I was using with the better ones as time and finances allowed. As far as groover blades, try taking that bevel down further and see how much better they work. Stropping that inside edge with the leather wheel is the ticket too.

Butch, I make my zippers to length, and keep them closed while I am fitting them and glueing into place. I also hold them in place with office supply binder clips for fitting and sewing. Some guys use double sided tape instead of glue. I haven't and can only share how I glue them. I use a thin bead of Barge on the cloth part of the zipper tape. I smear it out to the edge, and then heat it with a paint stripping gun to set it. It mostly seems to melt into the cloth. I add another bead and hit it with the heat again. This tends to sit on the surface and gives me the bond I need. Set it on the gusset or piece and sew away. When I just used one glue application, sometimes it would work loose as I was sewing. Two is better. Standard warning - respirate and ventilate, especially when you are throwing some heat to the glue. Keep a fire extinguisher nearby. I have never lit one up this way (kiss of death now saying that). Most all shoe guys heat it, and they don't seem to be burning up at alarming rates. Open flames will set it off though. I burned a thread tag end with a candle about an hour after sewing one in once. It popped and flamed the length of the gusset, zipper tape lit off, and make a spectacular little fire there. Right after that was when I replaced the crappy little shop kitchen-type extinguishers with a real one in the shop.

Todd, It depends on your definition of reasonable, but I really have liked everything I get from Trina Weber. Her website is www.weberstirrups.com. Easy to deal with. Weavers have brass bunds in their catalog. I got a pair in a deal from a shop that shut down, the brass is strap that was loose on the sides, kind of like the galvanized tin bound style. Trina bends them around the edge and they are tight.

Johanna, Thanks to you and thanks to Greg for bringing this up again. Great links, and ought to be required reading for everyone.

David, I would like to see how these trees fit on a horse. Perhaps it does work on a rider improving their horsemanship. However a guy who catches cattle for a living I think is going to have issues unless it is way different than I envision. First off, the PRCA guys are riding whoever their sponsor is - Cactus or whatever, a Billy Hogg, Tod Slone, or paying dearly for an old Howard Council. Proper horsemanship and raising the neck are the last things in their mind. They use tie downs and over and under to engage the hindquarters. I am thinking that when they reach out and stick one, they are out over the front, and the jerk is minimal now that they fade their cattle instead of set them. The jerk is forward and maybe to the side as they face. The heelers and the calf horses are getting a pretty much forward jerk. If these front bars are looking like what I envision they do, that takes a heck of a back cinch to keep them from tipping down. As far as ranch roping, it all depends on the cowboy, the horse, and the crew. Big cattle and green horses, and those calves can be hopping all over in front, beside, and behind. I think that constant pull and little jerks and more work than a rodeo run is harder on a ranch horse than a rodeo horse. The rodeo horse is set for it, the ranch horse is trying to get somewhere while all this is going on. Regarding the cutting horses. These guys are probably for the most part your brida riders. They have their feet in front ususally, and are pushing on that saddle horn to stay back. They are defintiely not up over the withers with their cracker butts in a 16-1/2" Cajun. I think a 200# non-pro being tossed forward and bracing up on the horn sticking up there is putting some force on that horn too. Probably more forward than the more downward jerk of a rope. I am not sure how those forces would factor out with vectors. The reiners in their Don Leson's or Bob's are not up over the withers either. I just have to think that most of the top horses have either really compensated for all of our mistakes, or that their are a couple ways to skin this cat. These folks are all loading their stirrups to some degree, as were the conqistadors and the dressage riders. Not to the same degree in each event and not the same throughout each movement. Not many people are sitting their like the proverbial sack of spuds while they are changing leads, doing transitions, or trying to stay in the buggy while their mount is turning a cow on the fence, or trying not to get bucked off. These are the people most of us have targeted in our businesses.

Man From Snowy River - because I like Banjo Paterson's poetry. You all know it is based on poem by Banjo Paterson written about a hundred years ago, right? I like Chisum, because because I like Ben Johnson too, I had a chance meeting with him 25 years ago in Pawhuska - a true gentleman. Memphis Belle for no particular reason. Lonesome Dove the movie was WAY better than the book it was based on. The Cowboys - yeah John Wayne dies, but it is yet another reason not to like Bruce Dern. Wargames - cool movie. Tom Horn - Steve McQueen's best, and I am a Tom Horn afficianado, he was guilty of poor judgement and drinking, probably not murder. Slapshot - My brother in law thinks it may be the most accurate sports movie ever made, I like it because it is funny (the uncut version). Breaking Away - I had a roomie from Bloomington and identifiable as an extra in several scenes, and I haven't had Noble Roman's pizza for 23 years, crave it every time I watch it. The Good Old Boys - I like Elmer Kelton's writing, and the actors were all who I'd of picked. The River of No Return because Marilyn Monroe really looks good in those jeans. Enough said.

David, Looking at the tree pictures here. Do you have one that shows the rock of the bars? At least from the front, looks like a lot of rock. Is this how you get them forward and up over the withers more, by raising the fronts through rock? I can see how that could move the rider forward. If so, doesn't this remove some of the force at the front bar pads, but then concentrates it at the low point of the bow, theoretically where the rider is sitting? Then if someone were to use the horn for more than puling themself up, wouldn't this make the whole affair tip forward and bear down on the scapulas worse. If I am reading something into this that isn't there sorry, but more pictures and where you set these on the horse would help.

I collect old books, mostly Will James, cowboy poetry, old California, western biographies, Charlie Russell, Robert Service, Banjo Paterson, and Will Ogilvie poetry. Thanks to my pal Harvey's suggestion, the buffalo (bison) skull has prominant place in the bookshelves. When I am not doing anything else, I am harassing rainbows at Lake Alpine, or browns in the Walker River.

Carr, Thanks. Actually, this is the only place I shoot lines. I will scribe in the guide lines to fill in on the "shadow" side of my makers mark, inlays, or center patterns. Otherwise I lay down one guide and roll. I did a tutorail in another topic on angled basket stamping with a template and angled basket stamping without a template. They pretty well show how I do a patch of basket.

Welcome Brian, That is the kind of work to be noticed around this forum. Feel free to jump in anywhere, just because a topic is old doesn't mean it is done. Like Jon, I have been admiring your work for a while too.

Jennifer, To get this back on track, you still have to fit bars to the back of your mare. That is the first order of business. Or the first order of business after she gets into shape whichever way you approach it. I'm with Jim, I'd get her in shape and then approach it. I think we all agree that she is built a little downhill. Picture angles and such can make that look one way or the other, but she probably won't shrink much in hind leg length, and might gain a little in front legs, will fill in and tighten up, but at four those growth plates are all but closed. You have what you have, and the lines down her side wherever you place them are going to be downhill. That is part of her, and a ton (no pun intended) of horses are that way. I've got one, and so have most people who have been around. People ride a lot of them and do just fine. The most square inches of bar on her with the least bridging and no edges digging in will fit her the best. That is the simple answer. The harder answer is - that is done with bar shape, spread, and angles. That has to be determined. What maker does to the topside is somewhat dependent on the bottom. Not always. but mostly. David, I have been following a lot of what you have written and on your website for at least a year and a half. Some I understand, and some I don't. I know you have some other ideas than many tree makers. I have seen the line drawings, but would be interested in seeing pictures of where your trees differ, and where you position them on the live horse. That would probably clear up a lot of the confusion. My seats generally have the same or more scoop in the side profile as the ones on your website, and really are not a lot different than many other handmakers. We may all be sitting pretty much in the same place? Maybe start a new topic to keep this one on track. I have to laugh on the painting. I am glad I wasn't a knight in 1500. If the live horse was bogged down that much in the back as in the painting, I am not sure my ride would have held up long enough to get to the battle, let alone pack me through it. I wonder how many of those mounted knights ended up in the infantry pretty early in the fight.

Kevin, I would just do a beveled raised area more or less in the same general outline, but just kind of fade into it with a beveler and matter. Almost like laying it on a cloud sort of shape. No distinct straight lines, and gentle curves in a long oval pattern roughly mirroring the outline of the stamp. My other thoughts would be to lay it on a wooden plank/sign and then bevel around that if you want to be linear with it. I think I have a demo of that, If not I have a piece in front of me I could repost.

I get used printers or press blankets from a local print shop. These are sheets used in printing presses by larger shops. One side is a rubberized , and the other side is cloth. They clean them with solvent, and I have never had a ruboff problem. The rubber side down on leather stays in place, I can write ID and info on the cloth side with a marker. The material is stiff enough I can run a knife or stylus around the edge and it holds position. It is flexible enough to sew for fitting models. Works up about like 4 oz leather. Dandy for sending a custom mockup to someone far away when you don't have the item to fit. These are not cheap to buy new, but when they start to wear, the print shops give them to me. I make all my cutting patterns from these. For large patterns I can sew or tape sections together. I can write things like gusset lengths needed, zipper lengths, and make registration marks for grooves and creases. I also use it to cover my anvil when I am setting rivets on damp leather to prevent black marks. Some guys use it to line tool boxes, or to protect blade edges in racks. Cuts with knives or scissors easily.

JW, My diamond is the cousin to yours. Mine is the Santa Fe diamond from Jeremiah. It has a distinct cut border. It is dang hard for me to bring back if you get off with it. I do a border with it once in a while, but I wreck most anything else. I saw a binder a guy did with it a the NFR a few years ago. I congratulated him on a nice job with that stamp. He had an $800 price on it. He said if he sold it, he would still be losing money. The first three tries went into the trash. I told him I could relate, but I mostly toss checkbooks. We exchanged condolences. This is one stamp that consistantly kicks my butt. Wayne Christenson had one made up by Bob Beard with a beadline type border. he said you just overlap the beadline and it keeps it lined up better. I could see that. Anne, Yes, it was Wayne's saddle he sent me the pics of.

Freak, Sorry I was too busy laughing until now to reply.

Johanna, I come from a long line of Scandanavian snoose chewers. I never smoked much, but started chewing Copenhagen regularly when I was about 12. I got to where it was just part of me. It was just something you do dawn to dusk and beyond. Nothing wakes you up like rubbing a little Copenhagen spit in your eyes at 3:00 am to get your forehead off the steering wheel. I never took those monster dips, and most people never knew I chewed, they never saw me spit (which was true, I didn't much). A lot of people never knew until I quit and it wasn't there. I took a physical for an insurance renewal, answered that I didn't smoke because that was the question. The blood test came back with nicotine off the scale. I got the option of paying smoker's rates (not covered by the employer) or quitting. If I took option B, they could test me anytime, and if positive threats of smoker's rates retroactive. It was going to mean that the $4.25 can of Cope could now cost me about 4 grand a year for insurance back then. Money was the winner. I quit cold, and guys say it is harder than quitting smoking or anything they used legal or not, and there isn't methadone for Cope. It took about a week of real misery. I could feel my heart (probably not a good thing?), cranky, nervous, checking between the ol' cheek and gum, sleeping at 2:00 pm and not sleeping at 2:00 am. I even packed an empty can so I wouldn't get that feeling like when you lose your wallet. I am still around guys that chew, and when I smell it, I crave it. Sixteen years later, I still like that smell. It is easier to say no now, but if I took a dip, I could be back in the buggy. Don't weaken now.

JW, Looks like a good one. I am especially impressed with anyone who can run that stamp. Thjis makes the second saddle In 3 days I have seen with that diamond. I don't know whether to wave the white flag and sell mine or buck up and learn to use it. Good job.

Darcy, Thanks for the pics. Here are some from an older Visalia I have in for a cosmetic restoration. The cantle measures 12-1/2x6. It is serial number 24589. Not sure exactly where that dates it, I need to call Griff. It is a pretty cool old saddle.

I have heard the definiton that it is widest at the base. Not sure from who. It is a little more defineable than another I heard. "It's narrow, and high, and no dish, I just know it when I see it". I might suggest we open this up just a wee bit and define how we each determine a regular vs. shovel vs. Taylor as well.