CB3200 needle thread fraying

[koreric75]

So, was going to practice with the 3200 and some scrap to try out a technique @JLSleather had mentioned keeping the walking foot impressions off your work...

, i didn't even get a few practice runs in, started one and was really going slow and paying attention to where things were lining up and noticed my thread fraying after each stitch was made when the needle was pulling back up from the bottom .....just one little length a couple of inches on each stitch.  So i changed the needle, didn't help, changed it again thinking maybe i got a bad one, still didn't help...double checked size #25 Organ needle 794 that came out of the pack that came with the machine.  Changed thread, changed bobbins, no joy...  So then I researched some, especially here via google, re-read the manual, went over the machine and checked for dust, dirt, burrs, and did a thorough cleaning and re-oiling by the manual.  I couldn't find any thing that would cause this.  I did find one little burr on the underside of the presser foot toe, right side middle of where the hole starts up the side on the outside.  It was enough that if thread was pulled across it with light tension it would fray and break.    I don't think this is in the thread path during stitching but smoothed it off jic and still same problem.  I am thinking my next step should be to remove the shuttle race and bobbin case assembly to check for anything i couldn't see or reach with the small brush but not sure whether this will affect anything?  The instructions in the manual make it sound easy, but this is under the "how to adjust feed dog height" part and that's not what i'm trying to do.  I don't want to do anything that will cause @SolarLeatherMachines to say..."didn't i tell you not to do this"...lol.    The last thing Alexander said to me was, it's all setup with #277 thread, #25 needle to sew belts, holsters, harnesses etc (as we discussed), just sew with it and don't dick with it...(not verbatim, but marines always have a way of saying things that make the bottom line stick in your brain...lol) I did a good spray of aerosol gun oil last night to let it sit and am going to wipe it down and see if anything comes of it, but wanted to post up here for advice/ideas if it doesn't.  I'll get a couple pics and a video this morning of the affected area as well and post back.  I mean, it's not enough fraying to break thread, and you can't see it when something is stitched.  I hadn't noticed it before last night, but it is worse on the white thread than black, stitch length didn't seem to change it, forward or reverse didn't seem to matter either.  Tension loose as a goose or tightened to where the know started getting close to the top didn't change it as well.  First time i've tried stitching a line and cutting along the tops of the holes on the stitch line to see exactly where the knot lands so I have learned a couple things I'm tagging(not all inclusive, as a ton of folks have shared info here that has proven valuable) a few of y'all that have provided advice on others, and saved me a headache or helped me better understand how the machine makes the stitch as well, I feel like it's when the thread comes up the back side of the bobbin case and back up through the feed is where this is happening but i can't for the life of me "see" it when it's happening.  If I can't figure it out today, i'll give solar-leather a call in the morning.

@CowboyBob, @Uwe, @Wizcrafts

[Big Sioux Saddlery]

I'm going to bet it's your Organ needles.  I've never had any that were any good.  Schmetz and Gros Beckert are better.  I had the same trouble with my 4500, changed from the Organ needles that it came with, instant improvement.

[CowboyBob]

Are you sure the long groove of the needle is one the leftside? What JSL technique were you doing? 

[JLSleather]

Shims, Bob. Shims.

 

[koreric75]

46 minutes ago, CowboyBob said:

Are you sure the long groove of the needle is one the leftside? What JSL technique were you doing? 

Yessir, I thought maybe I had put it on cocked at an angle, but it's perpendicular to the direction of feed and on the left side... I'm going to setup the tripod so I can get a pic and vid of it...

Using a piece of straight scrap to pad the walking foot toe to reduce impression marks along the stitch line...

39 minutes ago, JLSleather said:

Shims, Bob. Shims.

 

Lol, what he said... I just did a couple lines to test if the cleaning did anything, but still fraying, on a happy note, the shim worked great, just gotta get used to it so I don't wander off with the stitch line. Thanks again.

Edited June 3, 2018 by koreric75
added info

[koreric75]

41 minutes ago, Big Sioux Saddlery said:

I'm going to bet it's your Organ needles.  I've never had any that were any good.  Schmetz and Gros Beckert are better.  I had the same trouble with my 4500, changed from the Organ needles that it came with, instant improvement.

This is possible, I can't say for certain that it is a new problem, I just never noticed it before now...I only have the small pack of needles I got with the machine, I reckon I can order a small pack of another MFG just to be sure... I've only used the machine for a handful of projects, but I've put new needles in for each so I only have a couple of these left. I did try one of the previous needles that was only used to stitch a holster, it was the same out come.  Problem with this is with the needle out of the machine I can't run the thread through it at any angle and get similar results, but I haven't put tension onv the thread doing this either.

[koreric75]

Here is the link to the video on my youtube, and pics below...

https://youtu.be/mg4-mOMZYg4

 

[JLSleather]

Oh, yea -- definitely looks like it's fraying  at the "loop"

[Ferg]

Well, I am no expert on stitching/sewing but I have been doing it a long time.

Sorry, there isn't anything wrong with the organ needles, most problems with thread fraying in my experience is WRONG SIZE NEEDLE!

A side note: You have the presser foot pressure too tight. You are making a deep impression with the foot into your leather.

I understand you are using a scrap to sew in the vid. Your adjustments are way off.

 

Ferg

[jimi]

could it be the needle is fraying the thread when it passes through the foot , rubbing against the hole in the foot?? looks real tight in there.?? just a thought??