Trox

Hi Frank, Apparently html programming is not his cup of tea. My advice to him is to hire somebody qualified to do the work for him. Then concentrate on selling tools instead. I do not need any new tools, but if I see something nice, I might buy it. I will only compare his tools with other toolmakers in the same class (like Blanchard, Dixon, Osborne and other pro toolmakers having a catalog of their tools). I have seen what he has listed on Bonanza, his prices, 27 sales and 299 feedback’s (293 of them are imported from other sites, and cannot be verified) The six feedbacks from Bonanza are from users that only bought one item (purchase) each (ensuring? No). Some of his prices are normal, some is not. Some of the tools look like good old Barnsley other not. The plough gauge must be a joke, what toolmaker would put their name on that? What I am saying is; these are all things that make me as a customer on the alert. Small things that do not add up, and scare me away from buying something from him. A salesperson’s job is to make the customer assured of his products; so far, he has not done a good job. So if you can tell me what tool you bought from him, and if you liked it/them; that will be a much more useful feedback to us. Thanks Trox

Thank you Ben, For that Pdf with info. Great work and a very good presentation. A handy documet to use as referance for needle choice. Thanks Trox

Hi, I have one just like that, a Dürkopp Adler 267-990056-373. It is a medium rate upholstry class machine, triple feed, large hook. Adler still sell this machine (Weaver leather USA, among others) It sews up to 10 to 12 mm of material, but not with the thickest threads. Sorry only metric sizes; from TKT 60 up to TKT 15 (polyester/ braided polyester) (maybe TKT 10 on top and smaller in bobbin) But I have heavier sewing machines for thick thread, so I do not use it for that. This is the a strong well proven machine, without to much equipment, to keep the price down. It will sew everything you mentioned but holsters. Holsters are sewen with very thick threads; TKT 10 and thicker. Holsters normaly has three or more layers with thick leather (lining and welts). For this work you will also need a cylinderarm machine, like triple feed Juki 441, Adler 205-370 or clones (Cobra 3, 4 Cowboy 3500, 4500 and more) Or similar heavy leather stitcher. If the motor is as strong as 1,5 hp (1075 watts, that`s the biggest yet?) variable speed Mitsubishi, it is likely a stop motor with needle position. It will be more than strong enoch, and you will sew as slow as you want to. Look for that syncronisher head on the handweel (as on my Efka DC 1600 motor), if it has that it is a stop motor, it add`s value to the machine if it works (expensive pro motor like the Efka is). Do you have three phase current in your workshop? Ask Gregg from Keystone sewingmachine Co for a converter if you only have 110V single phase, he sell those motors . The motor is most likly not that big, 550w to 750w (1 hp) is more likely. 1 hp is more than enoch for that rating of machine. This is a very good machine, it is easy to get accessories and parts for it. High second hand value, high quality machine. Never had any problems with mine and It is a dream working with. I am very happy with mine, higly recommended. Trox quote name='FHL FERG' timestamp='1333323199' post='241986'] I'm looking at a Durkopp Adler 267-373. It comes with the table and the motor. The motor specs are: 1.5 hp 220 volt 3 phase 3600rpm variable speed Mitsubishi. From what I have read this model of Adler head is a medium to heavy duty unit. Is that correct? It will be my first and only machine for now. I will mostly use it to sew guitar strap type projects, maybe a holster, wallet or sheath from time to time. It should work for that I believe..... ? Will I be able to slow this motor down enough or will I need to look at swapping it out? if so what could I expect to spend on making the swap? Best I can tell, this should be the manual info for it: http://www.duerkopp-...%2F267%2F It looks just like this one..... Thanks for any guidance.

Hi all, I can not find a Adler 104-25, Adler did not make one. The Adler 104 came in subclasses;104-2, 104-VN2,104-VN2S, 104-23,104-64,104-102, 104Ws-102S, 104-4102S. The subclasses: 102,Ws-102S and-4102S has a hook that is angled 90 degree and face the operater. (This are special machines 2 needle ornament and so on). But all the 104 has hooks that turns the same way, they turn the same way as all the rest of the classes Adler big classes; 105, 204 and 205.( I have checked the complete list of Adlers 105 and 104, my own 105-25MO, class 204 and class 5, Sorry Bob but they all turn the same way) No 104-25 is produced, it may be as a special order. But why should they when they had the 104-23 The machine on the Google search is most likly a 104-23, that has the same feed as a 105-25; under feed and a driven upper foot. The feed can be adjusted different for ruffing work as Sewmun said. The machine for moccasins is the 105-25MO. The only difference on the -25 and the -25Mo is the needle plate and the feed dog. Install a feed dog and a other needle plate and you have a 25. When we refer to the jump foot, is is a spring loaded foot, the Adler 105-8 has this foot. Non of the 104 has a that kind of jumpfoot, the 104-23 has a driven upper foot as the 105-25 and MO verson. The ones with the driven foot ( a one foot walking foot) has no reverse. But you kan take of the stitch regulator locking plate (two screws) and set the driven upper foot to idle; and you have a reverse. Information on old Adler classes can be found here: http://sew24.blogspot.com/p/downloads.html Trox

I do not kow of any other than Blanchard that still makes tools. A old one is Mayer Flamery Paris.

I would claim it is the other way around, you can get much more tools and stuff in the US than in Europe. I buy very much in the your country I can not get here. I use my headknife for all cutting, except cutting around patterns. When you master the headknife you will use it for anything, skiving, cutting tigh corner with the tip`s. Rolling and angled cut, it is the most importent leather tools of all. I have round knifes, halv round ( Cornettes on French) and skiving knifes in Blanchard. Im am waiting for two older French round knifes (bought on EBay) of unknown maker. I am very exited about what they are, removing the patina to see the maker stamp. The French leather art from the time of Ludvik XIV " the sun king" is fantastic, they created the most unbelivable pieces of art. The tools they used was also the best. France has great traditions, it is a lot of beautiful old tools still around.

Then you will better buy from Siegal, I already have ten knifes from Blanchard so I am OK. The free shipping from Siegal is it for US customers only? I live in Norway, I have bought some tools from that Danish company before, the shipping is not much for me.

That will be about 100 euro. I f you only need a Blanchard round or skiving knife, I know a Danish site that sells them at a good price. The best thing is that they wiil not charge you any Danish (EU) tax, thats 25 % off the price you see on the website. They do not have so many Blanchard tools, but they have the best European prices I have seen. http://laederiet.dk/produkter/vistyper_engelsk.asp?id=24&Uid=33 It will be about 37,50 Euro for the 12,5 cm Blanchard round knife (plus shipping) I also find Blanchard and Dixon difficult to deal with, I buy old tools instead. Trox

Everything is better than a Tandy knife. If you buy a knife from Dixon it will not have an edge, the Blanchard has, but also need a lot of work. The Barnsley I do not know, but I do not feel secure about it yet. It is many hours grinding an edge on a knife like this, without a proper cold grinding tool and experience; it can be a real hustle. If you want a good knife, buy one from Bruce. You cannot get a new knife that compeer to the good old ones, without spending a fortune on a custom-made knife. Bruce’s tools are already polished and set up for use. I just received an Osborne leather compass and an 8 inch splitting machine that I bought from him, I am very satisfied. And I am already ordering more from him. You had better buy from him, buying from Hale and Co you do not know if the knife is a good old one, or a poor quality remake. I buy a lot of old tools myself, now I have five old head knifes waiting to get the treatment; removing rust, grinding and wheel polishing. I am using a full day on one, and the prices on old knifes are very high (too many that collect them). Check EBay and you will see that Bruce has great prices on his tools. That’s my two cents.

It seems like I totally missed the target here. I am sorry if I have offended anybody, this story was unknown to me. I am glad I was wrong. But it does not hurt to be a bit careful with all these remaking, branding and copying by today. I guess there were a big lot of old/new tools after all. If some of the tools are made today, the plough gauge must be one of them. Look at Bruce’s website and blog to see the real deal. Look at Blanchard’s web site to see how the tool should look today too http://www.vergez-blanchard.fr/boutique/liste_produits.cfm?type=31&code_lg=lg_fr&num=2 This was in 2009, and still Mister Hale does not have his website up running? Let us invite him in to this forum to answer directly too the customers, then maybe he will sell some more tools too. Somebody who has bought from him, please come forward:feedback: About J. Dixon and Vergez Blanchard tool/ knifes. I have been using Blanchard’s knifes for many years, it is very good knifes. I got my first Dixon head knife today, it was a T. Dixon and it was unused (without an edge and with a new nice handle. Bought private). I am still not finished cold grinding an edge on to it, so I cannot help you. If it turns out to be very good, it is still not available anymore. However, his son J. Dixon still make tools, he is a member here too. (I have a Dixon plough gauge it is a good tool, but it is an old tool too and not comparable )

I would not buy anything from this supplier, believing it is real George Barnsley and son tools, Sheffield. As everybody knows that company was closed down in 2003. http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=63682 It may be somebody bought the name, or it is possibly legal to use now; ten years after company closed down, who knows. They can make his tools in China, and using a postbox address in Sheffield UK. That plough gauge (as Bruce mention) is brand new, but look like is made out of a pattern for the earliest gauges; made nearly 200 years ago. Even stored in the global seed bank in Svalbard (Arctic), it would not look that new. If somebody had a big lot of new/old Barnsley tools, purchased before company closed down. Why be secret about it? It would be worth a lot more sold as is, why take all the trouble claiming the company still exist the same as before. A big lot of new/old tools are not likely to exist without any of our tool collectors and experts like Bruce knowing about it. If anybody has started up producing leather tools in the UK again, we would also know about it before they had made one single tool. It is called advertising. Then allow up to 45 days of delivery (30 in handling and 15 on shipping) For the average Ebuyer a bell should start to ring. Is it not the same magical amount of days you have to complain with in, to get an Ebayers protection? I do not know the Hale and Co, but to me it smells, like the famous small room. But I am no expert, only a concern customer.

I do not know the Sailrate; I was talking about industrial sewing machines in general. Where you often have the same machine head with different ratings and feeds. A bit overbuilt, made for continuous factory use and lasting a lifetime. I understand the Sailrate is an all-metal construction; however, it is not built for production. I think it was made for repairing sails onboard yachts. Made small and portable, for use when you need it in a yacht. It is not an industrial sewing machine, in the literal meaning of the word. I would not push my luck with that machine. It looks like they already have taken out all the performance it is good for. It is not like it is a Cadillac 500 Cid engine with only 190 hp, more like a Citroen 2CV triple turbo on steroids. Just my impression of it, I do not know the machine. Trox

Thats a copy of a Adler class 5, and so is the Singer 45K Trox

No flames, but the bigger needle can hit the hook. Check the distance from the needle to the hook. You can adjust the machine to use a bigger needle; setting a bigger distance between the needle and the hook. Example; the machine is adjusted with a Nm 140 needle and the distance should be 0.2 mm. Use that bigger Nm 180 needle instead, and set the distance to 0.2 mm. Adjusting the needle guard if necessary (if it is a vertical hook) (Doing so you will have issues sewing with the smaller needles; thinner needle = bigger distance. It will have trouble picking up the bobbin thread). You must also check if the hole in the needle plate and feed dog is big Enoch, The needle must have room to bend a bit. It is smart to have the safety clutch working as mention by Art. Remember to Increase the foot pressure, to keep the material in place. A bigger needle needs more force to penetrate and equal opposite pressure (down force) on the sewing foot. I do not know your Imperial thread sizes, but going up only one or two sizes, the tension will normally be strong Enoch. However, you cannot go in high speed. You will also have issues as small bobbin, holding only two meters of bobbin thread, sewing feet’s with to small needle holes etc. You just have to try, it sometimes work fine. But do not expect any refund or warranties if you break your new machine. Trox

Thank you both for those manuals, they where very useful to me. Especial the the adjusting with the papir strip part. I used to mutch leather adjusting my machine. No I have set my machine to a "zero position" by using papir strips. Keeping the knife sharp and free of burr, using the grinder and the hand stone at the same time; it works perfect every time. Thanks Trox

Hi, Listen to Art; what he ment was upper and needle feed. That is what you have left with that kind of needle plate. (Triple feed is; bottom, upper and needle feed) I would not buy that kind of machine, like the Ferco 1010. It is true it is economical, It is the cheapest kind of heavy stitcher made in China. Nothing wrong about Ferco, this machines comes under many different brands. It is a older model machine on its way out. Not many offer them anymore, the ones that does offer it as a economical solution. You must buy a machine with triple feed, You can buy a 441 clone 16 inch arm triple feed from Cobra, Cowboy or Techsew for plus 2K $. That is similar to the Ferco Pro 2000, and does the same job.Techsew sold that 1010 model before as model 180 something, they changed it with the new 441 clone (T-5100) The 441 clone from one of our dealers is a much better sewing machine, even in a nine inch verson. They are set up to sew leather up to 7/8 of an inch and comes with all kinds of attachments a saddler needs. Trox

Hi Buffalobill, I have an Adler class 5-27; it is the same machine as the 5-8. The 5-8 has bottom feed and a jump foot, forward and reverse. The class 5 is the forerunner of the class 105. I also have a 105-25 but I prefer to use my old class 5. My 5-27 sews 14 mm tick heavy leather; the jump foot works great on leather. The machine was made for sewing medium and heavy leather, having a bottom feed it will sometimes set marks on the leather. However, not as much as a bottom feed only machine will. The jump-foot takes away some of the pressure from the feed dog, when the foot jumps with the feed. Adjusted the right way, markings on the leathers backside is not a big issue. The stitch pattern is even and fine. This is the yesterday’s saddler machine, and cannot compare to the modern triple feed 441 or Adler 205-370 saddlers machine. Nevertheless, the build quality and materials is superb, I will not part with my machine. I will sell my newer Adler 105 and 204, but my class 5 stays. Made before the WW2 and still in new condition. The class 5 uses the same shuttle/bobbin as the class 105 first came with, some of the later 105 machines have changed their to the new big 204/205 shuttle. Using the new industry standard bobbin, same as the classes 204, 205, 441 and clones. The Adler class 5 cylinder bed, class 4 flat bed and Singer class 45 flat/cylinder bed (Similar machine from Singer) served Leather workers faithfully for over a half century. The Adler 205, Juki 441 and clones is now the new standard in the saddler business. Made in China, only time will tell if they last as long as the old class 5 did. Trox

I am sorry, but It looks like steel on the picture. Let me know when you ready to make another one. Thanks Trox

Hi Knipper, What a beautiful blade you made! Great job. I was looking for a new blade for my Dixon plouge gauge when I saw this. Dixon sells new blades on their web shop, but I rather buy one from you. Do you want to make more blades? Your blade is very beautiful, but would you consider using some brass in it. I kind of love the old toolmakers use of brass, brass also go nicely with the plouge gauge; it is a retro tool. The brass adds some warm color to the cold steel. Your handle construction is an improvement over the Dixon’s. Please send me a PM with a quote if you will make more blades. If I can afford it, I buy it. Thanks:You_Rock_Emoticon: Trox

Ok That explains it, 22 $ @ Kwokhing.com. ( you can use the Pfaff guide for your machine) Trox

I received the guides to day. One for my Dürkopp Adler 267-373 and one for my Pfaff 345. On the Adler, it is bolt on, 10 minutes job. On the Pfaff, I have to make a treaded hole. I will post when the job is done. I bought the guides from Kwokhing.com. Two guides with rollers and extra straight edges for both. Brackets and a set of binding feet’s for my Pfaff. All together 69, 70$ and 31 $ in shipping (Hong Kong - Norway). Great price, Great service, Great stuff. Top shelf all the way, very nice people to do business with. You can find the Adler KG 867 guide on Ebay for 90 $, I paid 25, 90$ for it, and 22 $ for the other guide, direct from the manufacturer. Great Deal, now I know where to buy all my attachments. Thank you Kwokhing. I will post the Pfaff guide when it is done. Trox

That wasn’t too bad. Yes, that might be the case. You can also use a manual for some of the other Pfaff post bed machine. Most Industrial sewing machine works and operates the same way. It is important to have a part list and if you will service yourself; a service manual. It is not always easy to get those service manuals, sewing machine repairs shops has their own and they see no reason to share them, so they will get fewer jobs. This machine threads the way it is threaded now, and in the same way that most other Industrial machines does. You most have a thread stand that takes thread of the top center of the spool (Important). A binding foot is for binding raw edges on fabric/leather with tape, together with a raw edge binding attachment. (Google it up). Search the forum, every thing you need to know is in here. You will need different feet’s for different jobs, piping feet’s, zipper feet’s, left and right harness feet’s and so on. The standard foot is a Blanket foot set. Wizcraft has a topic about it somewhere; you can also use Google to search the forum if you include leatherworker.net in your search. Good luck Trox

Hi Bob, It is not a very common machine where I come from, I guess you have to ask some one from down under. Good luck Trox

The motor want work well with out the sync, (position head). One to one ratio t is a bad idea it will not work. The machine itself is strong; it has built in gears that make it strong. You must have a big hand wheel to punch true heavy leather, that’s what makes a leather machine (among other things, this is a key) 　 You know how much that Adler costs? About 200 000,- Euro. And it is big, very big. Be careful to run the motor with out a sewing machine on, it will not work the right way. The machine also has to be grounded (the current). There is a stand-alone sewing pedal, with a cable available. You will need the speed control (pedal) for sure. With all respect, do some more reading up before you start; you have a lot to learn. Read posts about what makes a good leather machine, it all applies to your machine. Your machine is build for leatherwork; find out what makes it that good. Compare it to a normal Juki 441. It is important than you know this things when set up your machine. Then you will have some good question to ask me the next time, He he. We talk later, I do not like to read instructions my self, but we all have to. All the answers are in the forum to. Good luck, Later Trox