katsass

Sounds like you are using too much water for burnishing. Just a damp sponge will apply enough moisture. As for the dye darkening when wet molding -- it does, but returns to it's normal color when dry. I dye all of my leather after cutting the pattern -- allow to dry for 24 hours, then assemble. Prior to the final burnish of edges I wet mold, and again allow to fully dry. I then dampen the edge with a damp sponge and apply a bit of glycerin soap applied with a damp finger, burnish, polish and apply a finish. I have used Fiebing's dyes only for around 50 years, and have never seen the problem.. You might try and dilute the dye 50/50 with denatured alcohol -- most folks I know thin the stuff down A couple of burnished edges and a couple of wet molded holsters Mike

FWIW from the grump: My prices run right in there with Dwight --- and ALL of my stuff is hand stitched. I just can't imagine how you get a $150 to $200 cost factor for dead cow skin. You have 3 square feet of leather at the most, (3" x 72", divided by 144, times 2) and at even $9.00 a square foot that's only $27.00 for leather, actual cost. If I buy a 'special' double shoulder for a specific holster, I can't charge the customer for the ENTIRE piece when I still have most of it in stock for later use, and my holsters use twice the leather as most do because I use two layers of skin for each holster; a patern costs nothing, except the time to draw it; buckles be less than $6.00 at most; rivets and thread be incidental cost. I just don't understand. Mike

Well, I'm not an expert, (was told once, that many a self proclaimed expert is first, an EX -- a has-been, and second, a 'SPURT' -- a drip under pressure) but, after we have kicked this dead horse around a bit, your stitching doesn't look that bad at all, especially when compared to so much that I have seen. After you pick up a few proper needles and make your holes a bit smaller (back to the start of things) and use a shorter stitch --- I think you are off and running. You'll do good. Mike.

OK Jake, Give this a try. Stick your first needle through and snug up the thread. Pull the loose end of that thread back towards yourself some, and insert the second needle through that hole. Snug up that loose end 'til you have a small loop of loose thread. NOW look at where your first thread is laying. It will either be inside that loop -- or outside. It really doesn't matter which you choose -- as long as you do all successive stitches that SAME way. With the thread through the loop, the second thread is on top of the first and vicey-vercy. I personally always keep the second thread outside of the loop. Make your decision and snug up your stitch and keep going. Remember, all stitches are to be done in EXACTLY the same manner -- every time and in every way. Mike

From the grump: Thank Michael. What drilling (as I described and IMO) does, is allow someone new to stitching, and that is getting really frustrated, to put something together with somewhat more decent stitching than could be done before. Gives them a little pick-me-up rather than letting them go into the dumps from abject failure. JMHO Mike

Well, with the risk of being labeled a heretic, one thing that I have done to assist someone in learning to use the awl is to allow the use of a Dremel type tool -- with a 3/64" bit. Nothing larger than that.You can carefully drill them, and then set your piece in a stitching pony (or not) and open each with the awl -- just a bit. As you go, you'll learn how to hold the thing and about how much pressure is needed. If you mark the spacing with your overstitch, drill out a dozen or so, open them up a little --- pretty soon you'll be able to just keep going without stopping to drill more holes. It may take a while before the use of the awl becomes normal and easy, but remember this --- stitches CAN be pulled through the leather with pliers and not being opened up with the awl. To many this is just a terrible idea, but I think you'll find a hell of a lot more 'closet drillers' than will admit to it in public. Just a suggestion. Mike

From the grump --- again: First off I despise those 'stitching' punches. Pick up a decent (narrow) diamond (shaped) awl to poke holes with, and a #6 overstitch wheel to mark and --- go over your stitches when done (hence the name --over-stitch) then practice a bit with both. Second (maybe first) IMO Tandy was pretty good --- 40 or more years ago. Today they are more suited for the Cub Scout group activity stuff --- again IMO. I generally tell anyone starting out making holsters to get Al Stohlman's book "How to Make Holsters", it's well worth the $12 or so, and most all makers I know have their copy --- and even refer to it now and then. If purchased from Tandy, your needles are most likely 00 or even 000 in size -- too damned big --- again IMO. I have nothing to do with Springfield Leather except for being a satisfied customer, but you might call them (they advertise on this forum and have an 800 number) and get their catalog -- it has a pot-load of informational tidbits mixed in the pages. You can talk with the very knowledgeable folks about awls, needles etc.and get straight info from them, and see what a very good leathercraft dealer has to offer. Mike

From the Grump: Vinegaroon is nothing more than mild ferrous or ferric acetate (I can never remember which). It's made by dissolving as much ferrous metal in vinegar (4-5% acetic acid) as it will hold. To make, I get a gallon of the cheapest vinegar I can find, chop up three or four pads of fine steel wool and stuff it in the jug. Cover, but punch a hole in the cap to vent off fumes (good idea is to do it someplace other than Ma's kitchen) Wait a couple of weeks, and if the steel wool is all gone, stuff some more in and wait some more. Draw off, or siphon off and filter the stuff, so as to keep any of the nasty crud from the bottom of the vinegar jug out of your finished product. To use,, dump you leather down in the vinegaroon for a minute of so, rinse in a mild solution of baking soda and water for a little bit then rinse well in clear water. When dry, give it a light coat of neatsfoot oil to bring out the color. Wear rubber gloves so that your hands don't turn a funny color --- and stay that way for a week or two. The stuff is NOT a dye, it chemically reacts on the tannins in the leather and turns the leather black --- all the way through. Tannin may be increased in a piece of leather by soaking first in STRONG tea. This stuff is also called vinegar black, and has been used since (at least) the 1600s to blacken leather. Mike

Gotta agree that the Beretta NEOS pistol is a strange looking duck. Being brought up on classic Colt and S&W wheel guns and autos, NONE of the tupperware shooters are good looking, and many seem to have raised the barrel height above the hand to such a degree that they just don't appear right to me. But Glocks --- still be ugly. Mike

FWIW from the grump: Both of these guys are right IMO. Ferg has been at it a long time and Markush does some pretty good stitching. Holes are too big --- If you can pull the needle through the hole with your fingers, they're "too damned big" --- that is exactly what I was told (and taught) over 50 years ago, and I still use a small pair of smooth jawed pliers to stitch with. If not using harness needles (I generally use a #1 size, but no larger than a #0) you may be splitting the first strand through. And, about 6 SPI is a good, all around stitch size. It almost looks as though you are using synthetic sinew for thread --- tain't that good an idea for holsters, again, IMO. I have always used waxed linen threads. Nyltex is also a good thread. Remember, always start each stitch from the same side of your project, then go either over, or under, that one with your second needle, BUT, ALWAYS do each succeeding stitch in EXACTLY the same way, either over, or under, but don't mix them.. Mike

From the old grump: Ray, I'd think that Fiebing's Cordovan might be a god place to start --- then start dripping some red into it. Used cordovan on this holster --- thinned 50/50 with denatured alcohol.. Mike

FWIW from the grump: I KNOW, for example, that the width of a Govt. Model .45 is AROUND 1" , just as I KNOW that the cylinder diameter of a .38/.357 Colt, S&W, and most makers other than Ruger , is about an 1 1/2". I can eyeball a half inch or 3/4 inch pretty well and go from there when drawing my patterns. And remember, wet leather stretches real well, so trying to mess with POINT 19 inches. or POINT 08 inches is counter productive. You are working yourself into a frazzle trying to mess with that type of measurement. You have to open things up here and there for the width of the frame on a wheelgun, just as you need to ease in a bit on some places. Same with auto pistols. Play with some junk leather for a bit and you'll see where things need to be opened up some and/or tightened up some. Experience is about the best way to get the feel of doing this kind of work. And remember, if you make it too damned small. you can usually add a welt and come out OK. Here's an example: I took on a job (like a fool) without having the gun to make my initial silhouette from, but was told that it was EXACTLY the same size as another model made by the same manufacturer. The gun wouldn't be available for about a week but I started anyway. I started by drawing my pattern, cutting the leather and even stitching down the belt loop. When I got the gun I found that ( other than being the shiniest pimp gun I ever saw) it was a bunch wider than was told to me. What to do? Make a welt so it would fit. Here are pics of that holster. I didn't lose anything but just a bit of time. Experience is the best teacher IMO --- I've been at it for a little over 50 years now, and still learn stuff, just don't make it more difficult than it is. Mike

FWIW from the old grump: I was taught (over 50 years ago) that IF you can pull the needle through the leather by hand (or fingers) "the holes are to damned big' --- that's just what my instructor said. I've used a small pair of smooth-jawed pliers ever since. Mike.

FWIW from the old grump: Both look pretty good, don't see anything that's done wrong. I do think that you'll find, however, that, with the ostrich overlay, you might want to stitch the front all of the way around the mouth and the toe of the holster. Even though you probably used a good contact cement, in time the ostrich may still try to separate off the cowhide. I make most all of my holsters from two layers of something around 4/5oz leather --- bonded down on their flesh sides. I find it safer , and usually more attractive to stitch all edges when using multiple layers of leather. JMHO. Mike

FWIW from the grumy old guy: I started out using a small airbrush only compressor --- didn't work worth a rat's tookus. Bought a 1/3 horse, 3 gallon, oil-less, adjustable compressor from Harbor Freight (item number 95275). I set it to 45# and it works great, but it will go to 100# --- but that pressure will blow an airbrush apart. Just a little messing with fittings for the hose, and it was off to the races. Mike P.S. 'Tain't very quiet though.

Damned well better NOT!

\Or the 1955 vintage M-24 3" .44 Spl. One of the early Lew Horton Specials. Mike

From the grump: Glad you got 'er figured out. I never have done anything but dunk my stuff in the vinegaroon, so that never even occured to me. Mike

Well I use an old Osborn diamond awl that I've had for about 40 years. Sharpened and stropped frequently till it got down to about 1/8" in width. It's a sharp pointed little beggar with a blade length of just under 1 1/4". Mike

Well ---- I'm really not trying to be a smart A#$%, but, I've been doing this for over 50 years now, and somewhere along the line it got to the point that I just 'know'. I draw a design and pattern for every item I do --- even if it's for the same model of gun or knife that has been done the day before. When done with an item, I toss the pattern. When I've drawn a pattern, I just know how it's going to go together and where I need to glue things up. It's in my mind's eye and I can see it --- and just do it. I know it sounds trite, but I just don't need to mark things like that, and very seldom do I miss --- although I've drawn out a pattern and (being left handed) reversed it and made a real nice holster for a southpaw by mistake --- but only twice. Mike

FWIW from the old grumpy guy. I've been making custom only (no stock items) holsters and knife sheaths for over 50 years now, and along with a good name, a distinctive maker's mark or logo also helps. Almost every customer remarks on mine, be they a return or first timer. Many first time customers advise that they saw a piece of my work and saw my mark which they just couldn't forget. I have more comments and new customers from that silly little mark than from any other form of advertising. Just saying, something to think about. A pic of one of my sheaths --- and my mark on it's backside Mike - Katsass Leather

From the old grump: Although I'm not a big fan of IWB holsters, you done good. I like it, and IMO more boning or molding isn't necessary, especially for an IWB. I have carried my old M-36 in just this simple pouch (well, or one like it - this is the second one I built) for over 50 years --- on and off. Primarily in the warm weather, which is most of the time here in the desert. Left handed, it sits at the 7:30 area, snugged into my chubbies and covers well with a loose shirt. Mike

From the old grump: I suspect, but am not sure, that your initial shot of EVOO may have something to do with it. I cut my leather, dump it in the vinegaroon, then a quick baking soda bath and rinse with clear water, allow to dry then assemble, stitch and burnish edges.. Apply neatsfoot oil and forget the thing for a couple of days. Apply Mop & Glo with an airbrush (or an old Windex pump sprayer works just as well) by just 'misting' it on. Allow to penetrate and dry for 20 minutes or so and hit it with the mist once more.Allow to dry for a couple of hours. Rub in (by hand -- no applicator) a light coat of Kiwi neutral polish and buff out. The warmth of your hand (fingers) helps get the polish down into the pores of the leather. Never had the problem you explain. I suspect that the EVOO is lifting the Mop & Glo and won't allow it to penetrate well. The oil doesn't dry, it tries to permeate the leather fibers evenly and, even in our 100 degree temps here in the desert, it takes some time. Sounds like, maybe too much of a good thing, to soon.. Mike it

Very well done. You --- and your customer should be very happy, BUT, somehow I feel that 'elegant' and 'Glock' together in the same sentence is an oxymoron -- Glocks IMO just be ugly.shooters. I carried a Glock 21 for a number of years --- but they still be ugly. LOL Mike

Call Springfield Leather @ 1- 800 - 668 - 8518. They are easy to talk to and deal with. I have nothing to do with them other than being a very satisfied customer. Mike