Billsotx

Probably less time than it takes a geezer to open those stickin' packages ... lol!

Besides metal you can use delrin for support. Plenty of it comes to us in packages we buy. It's that senior proof plastic you wrestle with everyday :-) ... buy it whether you like it or not. My awl likes it better ... and you can tell your clients your holsters are laminated with space age plastic - or is it another man's trash ...lol! You can stiffen up mouth bands and belt loops and belts; better stuck in a good holster or belt made better, than swirling in the Pacific Ocean and gagging a fish. One just scrounges what works, and come to think of it you could put it in a scourge but that goes over on the adult side of this board ... lol!

STONEHEDGE LEATHER CO., as for PHIL LEDUC, 1967 ABBOTT ST SAN DIEGO CA 92107-2846 (619) 223-4211 -or- (888) 805-9690

Now the father in law needs to spring for a decent gun belt and mag pouch; give him the family discount ... lol I'm with Jeff on open at the muzzle. It used to be SOP to gas the scout car and vacuum it at the start of tour of duty and vacuum the holster also. All kinds of curd collects in a closed holster and it doesn't just fall right out when you up end it. Nice piece of work Jeff !!!!!!!!!

I would run the retention strap up over the back end of the slide so that you can get a firm and final firing grip on the piece before making the presentation. That will also make holstering more practical as the straps won't have a tendency to block the mouth of the holster as you go back into the leather. Holstering must be done with one hand and without looking down - just as a presentation should be accomplished. Just run your retention strap up over the back of the slide and you'll have good clearance for a proper firing grip and smooth presentation. Smooth is quick and that's what serious handgunners are looking for. From a training (user) standpoint, if a holster prevents you from getting the proper firing grip while the piece is still secure in the leather it should be modified or deleted from your kit. That's some real nice looking leather Jeff, and "I think" you can take it to a higher level if you tweak the retention strap up over the end of the slide.

Have you looked at the c&l Springfield 1911 on Ring's web? It might work for you. Look in the pdf catalogue. In an email from John Ring he said: "We do a big business with holster manufactures, using our weapons for plugs. The weapons are solid and blue throughout. We do recommend not having the “Final Finish” put on the weapons, which is a light coating of die. This sometimes comes off on the holsters during your manufacturing process." I think you're best bet is to call them: Ring's Manufacturing, 99 East Drive, Melbourne, FL 32904, (321) 951-0407 Ph., (321) 951-0017 Fax, www.blueguns.com. Like you say their products are tops and so is their customer service, in my opinion. Hope this helps. ~Bill

t-nuts Art, They're used for retention devices on holsters and mag pouches, to attached scabbards to belt loops, holsters to belts, etc. The black ones I've got appear to have been painted and they look pretty shodding. I have no idea of their source of origin. Y'all let me know if you're going to gang order as I'm interested. Bill

To bevel edges on gun leather I like a round bottom edger because those TLF bevelers give you a flatten almost concave edge; of course you can modify the TLF from concave to round bottom with a file and then re-sharpen it if you're tight on funds. (Who isn't with the Saudi's taking over the world.) I use a creaser instead of a groover for those deco creases at the mouth and muzzle of the scabbard. Some folks like a groove but the crease is most often seen on high end gun leather like Milt Sparks. You'll find the free hand groover more versatile than the edjustable model, but you can free hand with it too. They both take some practive as previously mentioned. It takes a while to get the knack of grooving and creasing for that matter. I use a free hand creaser for every thing; some folks call them ticklers. For practice just mark off some lines on scrap and then groove or crease them. Do curves, switchbacks, and 90 and 45 degree angles - it's usually easier to move out from the angle than stop at it. You can get a bunch of practice on a little bit of scrap. For a round bottom edger check out Horse Shoe Brand Tools Horseshoe Brand Tools , his edgers round bottom edge beveler were larger than the norm in my experience. He's a straight-up guy to deal with. In burnishing moisture is the key and then the number of passes not how hard you rub. Lots of passes and speed gives you the friction for a glass like edge. Make the first 10 passes in the same direction and then rub back-and-forth. Pay attention to the way the edge begins to lay down or fuzz up as there's a grain and if your first 10 or so passes are with the grain you'll get your burnish going much quicker. Don't get it to moist or you'll be rubbing for a while. Experiment with various medium, canvas, denim, the handle of an edger, a piece of antler, a wooden dowel a piece of brown paper sack, the backside of wet/dry sandpaper. You'll find a favorite, but there's no one way. Leather is not all the same and that's a good reason to stay with one tanner and pay attention and make notes if you use different types and kinds of leather. Not trying to be the teacher or the preacher: If you spit on your burnished edges I wouldn't advertise that, some folks won't appreciate your humor ... lol!

I used a t-nut, a stainless bugle head screw and stainless grommet. You can find them at Lowe's, Home Depot, Ace type hardware supply. You can use them to mount removal belt loops also, so they're multi-purpose.

Regis, I very gently remove the pistol once I'm finished with the detail boning. Gently so as not to upset the shape, then I squeeze the mouth together very slightly and the same for about 2 inches of the muzzle end. I want a tight fit once it's dry. I prefer to have a little break-in instead of a loose, so-called fast holster. Actually, I've never seen a fast holster. Mine has never gone anywhere ... lol! If the holster is super tight, spray it thoroughly with silicone spray, holster the pistol and let it dry 24 to 30 hours. That can be repeated but usually one time does the trick. Just keep in mind that all leather is not the same and if you're getting leather from economy sources and of unknown origin you may not get the same results - leather ain't just leather. Hope this makes since and helps out. I appreciate all of your comments.

I slick, cut, glue/stitch mold by hand with a piece of white-tail antler, aluminum rod and the handle of an edger; nothing super special. The holster is 8/9 oz, the mag pouch & belt are 6/7 oz.; the billet liner is split down to 3 oz. for ease in buckling and comfort.

Did this rig for a friend I used to work with: HO veg-tan rough-out, natural russet.

I've never tried what you're doing, just thinking out loud. Did you slick the leather before you start molding? Case it, don't drown it, and then slick it. It may get too firm, but you can sure tighten it up and workout some of those wrinkles.

Tony Kanaley owner of Milt Sparks is on this forum. Maybe he'll answer that for you. I suspect part of it is in the leather he buys. Leather ain't leather. The best holes are made from veg-tan hides. If you buy from W&C try pasted, HO calls it Mossback. If you want black, buy drum dyed or you'll have fun with rub-off.

Get Stolhman's book on The Art of Hand Sewing. It's the best 10 to 12 bucks you'll invest in stitching. Search this forum for stitching and sewing as there's several good posts of the topic. As suggested spend some time in practice. Repetition is the mother of skill.

Art, I've taken several apart. It is spring steel. I don't know where you can get them. Dependent on cylinder size you'll need several sizes: J, K & N frame sizes for sure. That's still not going to cover everything, but it'll get the main stream. There's other springs systems but I don't know the source of those either. While your surfing watch for Hoyt and Berns-Martin. You probably won't (get) see a Berns cheap. The last one I watched went for over a hundred and it looked pretty beat. There's a Hoyt knock-off, but the name escapes me know. I'll go to ebay later and see if I can jog that name loose. Hope this helps. Bill

You're giving away the secrets. Why not put a nice sharp and stropped awl blade in the drill press, set it at the correct angle to the stitch line and end up with nice holes that look like they were hand punched with an awl? SSShhhhhhhhh.... don't give up the secrets ....

Ray Chapman, one of the fathers of modern pistol craft, 79, ... passed away Saturday, Feb. 2, 2008. Chapman Academy - Home of John Bianchi's - Bianchi Cup Obit below: http://www.columbiatribune.com/2008/Feb/20080206Obit005.asp Thanks Ray, for showing the way! We are sadden but glad we learned from what he shared. Condolences to his family and friends. ~Bill

Cool! Thanks for the repost. Nice job on the Meanea pockets knock-offs!

You didn't mention which Fiebing dye. There's a bunch of stuff out there and dye ain't dye and leather just ain't leather. I've had good luck cutting Fiebing Professional Oil Dye with wood alcohol. The sell a reducer to thin and dilute it and it smells like wood alcohol and the dye is alcohol based according to the label. Wood alcohol works and you'll get more for your buck than you will their reducer. Of course, there are the water based dyes and the low VOC, which I think are also water base. So not knowing what you're using as dye I'll ramble here. Anyway, if you do this diluting of dye, measure it out don't just start pouring things; and keep notes so you can duplicate or avoid what doesn't work, and work on scraps of whatever you're building. I'm assuming you're only working with veg-tan leather. Even then, don't expect to get the same results on the next hide; it's usually close but that's not a given. I usually start with 1:1 mix. Make a small batch in case it's not what you like. You might try wiping the surface lightly with an alcohol soaked rag before you dye, or try Fiebing deglazer if you have it. Some tanners put a sealer on their leather. They'll change their process and you won't know it, so test. I've even got by with rubbing alcohol for surfacing cleaning. If I'm out of wood alcohol, I find rubbing alcohol will clean pretty well. I like 70% as 50 doesn't seem to work well. For cleaning and prep I've also had good luck with Lexol pH cleaner, and at times I've used various commercial cleaners for auto upholstery. I keep going back to Lexol as far as cleaners and haven't had good luck with saddle soap. Others swear by saddle soap. You'll have to do some experimenting and I would keep notes and when you find what works stay with it until it doesn't work, and that may happen with all this environmentally safe voodoo that's going on. I used Tandy Pro Dye forever, then they went Al Gore and the search started over and I'm hoping Fiebings doesn't drop the Pro Oil as I think I've got that figured out, except for black. In talking with the folks at W&C there is no black dye short of drum dye that won't rub-off. Black will have to be sealed. I've also blackened with vinegaroon and I still got rub-off; that has to be sealed. As Bob has already mentioned the air brush works well for an even coat, but you'll still have to experiment and you'll probably have to dilute the dye to spray it; also to get your lighter color you're after. If I'm not spraying the dye on, I use a piece of shearling or a sponge and apply in circular pattern and do as you mentioned - prime the surface before application. If I use water for a prep I spray it on, use distilled water because water is just water and you want a constant when you can get it, and then wait until the leather starts to return to it's natural color. It doesn't take a lot of water and I just use a hand held spray bottle. That's after I've cleaned the surface to remove any oil and dirt from my hands, tools, work bench and whatever may have been there when I bought it. You ever notice a spot that just won't absorb dye? I don't usually see that if I've cleaned and prepped. For edges I've mixed dye into a finish like Fiebing Leather Sheen and come up with a lot more durable edging than Edge Kote. I've had Edge Kote peel off like a long string of caulk. Besides the book by Stohlman there's one by Peter Main you might look at. I've seen that at Tandy also. There's no simple way, dye ain't dye and leather just ain't leather and what you get used to may change. That's what makes it challenging and why everyone's not turning out top notch stuff. Keep notes and when you find the mix stay with it until that road plays out .... Click over to Fiebings and click on LeatherCraft and check out all their stuff: http://www.fiebing.com/ Note all their stains. All that like if you decide to mess with stains make a trip to Lowes or Home Depot, Wal-mart, whatever and check out water-based wood stain. Anything that will stain wood, will also stain leather and the water-based stains are pretty forgiving. Esp. when it comes to diluting and making them lighter. Let us know how it goes and if you stumble onto something good and different we'd like to know. By the way, Angelus also makes dye, but I haven't found it any better than Fiebing. It's different, but no better in my experience. I have found that they are more knowledgeable than the folks I've talked to at Fiebing. The bottom-line is they're all out to sell you something and there's a lot of variables, so what they tell you may not work. Like hands - dye and leather is the same - but different .

Andy, Cut you some little strips, like small band-aids, from mole skin to make padding for your fingers. Band-aids won't last long, but the mole skin will hold up for several hours. You'll eventually get callouses and won't need to do that; it'll ease the pain in the mean time. The Art of Hand Sewing by Stohlman is the bible on stitching if you don't have a copy it's worth the dime.

Yo Gyrene, What you might consider, especially since your working with the wide slide. Take a look at the Summer Special on Milt Sparks website - the shape and design. Then build you another IWB of that style and design, but build it more closely toward the original S/Spl that Bruce Nelson built. At a glance that original holster may seem too limp and wimpy, but we must consider the purpose and exactly what Nelson was doing - under narcotics assignments - highly concealable, readily available, practical, utilitarian. Worn either in the appendix or cross-draw. It was not intended to be a range holster, the 7/8 oz. design would come later and mainly from copies. The original S/Spl was constructed of 3/4oz. leather, flesh side out, with a mouth band and belt loops constructed of 7 to 8 oz. hide. There was a metal liner within the mouth band and the very first design (in fact most of Nelson's) had only 1 belt loop, which in the beginning were all cut from a single piece of leather. The metal liner was galvanized sheet metal, it was cut from gutter flashing, as were the mouth bands on his IWB magazine pouches. It ain't pretty, but it works. You might experiment a little and not necessarily copy the original design. Install, or at least provide for two belt loops when you install the mouth band. I would make the loops detachable which is what Nelson sometimes did in his late design. That allowed the user to change belt widths and still have a good tight fit. We know the loops must fit the belt tightly and Nelson was adamant about that. Going with the detachable belt loops you could then experiment with one only, or either, or both loops. Nelson's method was to use a t-nut and bugle head screw to attach the male or stud side of the snap. Ideally a one-way snap. The t-nut and liner are stitched inside (under) the mouth band, then punch a hole and slip one end of the belt loop over the t-nut where the nut protrudes through the mouth band, and then set the snap stud over the belt loop, and install the screw. That snap stud gets the bugle head screw which if the right size is countersink into the recess of snap stud and of course the other end of the belt loop gets the female side of the snap. (Make extras if you wear different width belts.) The original S/Spl does not lend itself to being a great range holster, but it's light, compact and most of all it helped to achieve the primary rule of a gun fighting - Bring a gun! The attached pix is not from an S/Spl but a Nelson Patriot (that one snapped over the belt), nevertheless it illustrates the order of installation that he used. I believe the removable belt loop(s) will let you experiment with placement of the loops, where you position on the belt, as well as the cant - sort of tweak it to your liking. Look forward to seeing your next one. Your work's improved exponentially in short order! uuuuuuurrrraaahhhh! ~Semper Fi and Watch Your Six!

I with Aaron on boxes and manila folders for patterns. If you mess one up and you will don't be so quick to toss, especially if you're half-way there. If you cut too much off or punch a whole in the wrong place tape it back and move on. When you get it right then redo you're working template. Masking tape, duct tape and carton tape are always close at hand. When I open glue or dye it over an old cereal box. I varnished over a huge blotch of USMC black right in the middle of my work bench, left as a reminder - Don't dye stuff without covering me up. ... Luckily the varnish worked because rub-off was endless. I could have easily replaced the top of the bench, but I need reminders. ... Eat cereal! We need more boxes! ... lol! Good thread here Johanna!

IWBs ... you either love 'em or you hate 'em. I hate 'em. I been wearing a gun all day, ever day for forty years. About 5 minutes of wear and I'm done. I know guys that been wearing them all day, every day and they claim they don't know they're there. Don't mean you shouldn't keep trying. You might find one. That's the part about rolling your own. You're showing you skill mortier-man. ... oh-three-hun-erd here ... but ain't we all? ... lol! Semper-Fi!

I don't know what the pattern costs but the Stohlman book on holster making is only about 12 bucks and will show you how to make patterns and holsters. There's lots of illustrations and easy to follow directions. Get it and start with manila folders and cardboard and masking tape and eventually leather. A few runs at it and you'll be designing your own and people will be pestering you to make them one. What you'll end up with after a few tries won't even resemble those old generic over the counter bags. If you get jammed up, pose a question to the leatherworker.net consortium. That's why it's the largest unofficial leather-craft guild ... lol! Might as well make you a couple of mag pouches while you're at it and stout belt. You'll have a rig to brag about when you get done.