Singermania

HI Cowside, what size and type?

haha, can you prove its yours... I'll have to reverse litigate for all the ones you've stolen from me.... nice to have a sense of humour...

Yes agree with you, trust you enjoy your time and work.

The Boss and Outlaw are a very different machine to the Cowboy CB4500 or even the hand crank CB3200. With the price here in Australia of $1950 and $2600 for the Outlaw and CB3200 HC.... if you have a permanent workshop facility I'd go for the CB3200 for the bit extra..... however if space is cramped or you want a portable machine for shows and markets then the Outlaw comes into its own. Clearly though the CB4500 is the ultimate machine for the bigger in situ jobs.

There are a few hand operated leather machines on the market, in Australia our Cowboy brand does a CB2500HC (hand crank), a CB3200HC (hand crank) and we are now awaiting the arrival of our Cowboy Outlaw machines. However there are other makers, some that comes to mind are the Luberto machine, the Pearson (BUSMC) No 6, and the Boss.

Its not motorised cos its meant to be a portable low cost hand crank machine. If you want a motorised machine you might as well buy a CB3500 or CB4500, then you get compound feed, reverse and all the feet and plates. The Outlaw is going to be a great machine to take on the road and don on the spot repairs or for those with very limited bench space. We have been told at Cowboy Leather Machines in Australia that we can order it next month, its going thru rigorous testing now.

HI Alexander, yes I agree with you, absolutely no argument from me. We work the same way here in Australia, we try to anticipate what might be confusing or might go wrong and take steps to minimise. I would say perhaps I delivery in 5 gets a phone call asking a question, other than that they are all set to go..... considering some of the customers have never had a sewing machine of any kind before that's pretty encouraging. Cowboy Leather Machines has gone from a turnover of around $25,000 when we took over 3 years ago to about $400,000 this year so doing the right thing, offering good prices and backup and taking time to talk to people pays dividends for everyone.

Although it is sometimes done, I would never recommend shipping a head on top of a table, the 4500 weighs about 150 lb or 70 kg, too much for a table and castors to withstand on a bumpy journey. Sometimes shipping is free with the price of the machine, however you usually have to pay port charges which are substantial. We order about $25,000 a month and the port and charges amount to about an extra $5000

You'll easily make a new seat with the new machine, really not hard, you just cut out the pieces and sew em together...

You will love the CB4500, the difference is amazing. They are super reliable, tough and very adaptable, so you can go from light to heavy jobs without a blip.... the optional flat table is good but we only sell one in about 15 machines... we say to people they are $185 but you can knock one up out of plywood in a couple of hours. If you are doing big jobs then that table is not big enough anyway and you'd be better to cut a slot in a bench and roll the machine in.

Ok Forester, I didn't see them on the list of authorised dealers, how is it you had to put it together?

Sure RockyAussie, its not a competition, the guy is from Europe so would be more inclined to recognise M20 rather than ticket 20.....doesn't hurt to have a second chart. The charts are only a guide, you cant expect them to be exact for every thread ever made.... anybody can work out to try up and down to see what works best. It also shows a 200 needle for M13 which might be better at 180... but when someone puts something up for nothing its hard to complain.

Hi, sorry no I mostly have manuals for older leather machines like Singers, Champions, Pederson, Koch, Atlas, Busmc etc

I can try to attach it here, otherwise I'll need an email.... Singer-Class-132K-Sewing-Machines-Instructions.pdf

Hi this is a better chart for those in metric....if your thread is 20, the that's most likely M20 which the guys in the US will call 138..... so the needle is a 140 which means its 1.4mm thick, or the old singer number or 22 Wizz's chart does not show the metric thread size. When you get time print out the chart and laminate it.

yes the 1000H needle can be used in the 97, they are only slightly longer....however they are still not much good as you cant get them in leather point or smaller sizes. The only real solution at the moment is to down size to the 794 needle, this will mean your beast can only sew 3/4 " rather than 1". I have a couple 97-10 machines, also like cowside have some big needles, anyone that has the thinner needles sizes would be nice to hear from. Or if anyone has the 1000 needle in leather point?? I would also like to find Pearson no 6 needles.... the 331L in 160 and 180

the Adler 205-64 is a needle feed only machine, still good, but not compound feed

These machines are not Juki 441 clones but more closely related to the Seiko CB-8b, which were a fantastic machine, however I have had a few of these machines in the workshop and found them to be fairly problematical. Even out here in Australia they were common as they were about just before the Cowboy and other 441 machines gathered in numbers. You might find parts hard or expensive. If it was me I would not buy one, but buy a used Adler 205-370 or Juki 441 style clone.

the Juki 341 is a heavier machine than the 227R,,,,, you'll get 8 or 9 mm thickness out of the 227 but the 341 will sew 11mm with a 15mm footlift. the 341 looks roughly the same size but every component is that bit heavier, do the lift test and you'll feel it. In the Cowboy range in Australia our compound leather range runs....227R....7341....3200...then up to the 4500

agree with all above, the 227r will run up to about 138.... depends a bit on the thread.... you will see 138 on the left of the chart, that is your upper limit.

Without having met Bob Kovar I do work in the industry and can tell you he is one of the best about, if he or his people did not reply there must have been a glitch in the system at one of the ends....

Yep as Uwe says...... haha We have just introduced the Cowboy CB7341 which is similar to your machine, we did that because that model is so good!!! also has the big bobbin...

If you are planning on sewing a lot of canvas then buy a machine, but if its just a bit then your present machine can handle a blanket foot and needles down to about 130

HI, its Steve Bonnett of Cowboy Leather Machines in Australia, I collect old machines and so have also chased up manuals. I have the Champion manuals on computer if you need them... regards

Agree with that above, if you turn with the needle out you can increase the distance at the point at which it lands again.... Not sure about the stitch length being smaller on the other face. Generally speaking the modern sewing machine like the Cowboy CB3200 and Cb4500 have needle bars that swing like pendulums, so the thinker the material the shorter the stitch is going to be.