Chinese Imported Sewing Machines

[kgg]

49 minutes ago, DrmCa said:

I got one, and it stitches, out of the box.

The first thing I would advise is to change the needle system to 135 x 16 or 135 x 17. That would give you a better range of needle size selection and thread sizes.

Good luck,

kgg

[DrmCa]

Once I run out of their needles, I certainly will!

[Frodo]

save  your money. 

I have one,  And I am advising you to save your money

[chrisash]

My question is how well it sews, we all know they are built to a low price level,

But how different is a patcher say singer 53 or older, row of stitches than a Chinese patcher that's set up properly.

If you were given two sets of stitches could you really identify what one was made by the Chinese version

[kgg]

2 hours ago, chrisash said:

But how different is a patcher say singer 53

As I maintain they do have their place but... for the average hobbyist they are more of a tinkers machine that could get you out of a pinch. I wouldn't invest in one as an only machine or as an alternative to a good Singer 29K or even a clone of the Singer 29K. I do have both the Singer 29k and a China Patcher which is delegated to the darkest corner of the basement for probably an out the door journey after two more tinkering projects.

kgg

[chrisash]

Thanks but that does not answer the question, its not if you like the machine or not, that's like asking if you like a ford focus over a BMW.

Its about if you can tell the difference in a blind test (not knowing who made what) of the stitches.

 

[Constabulary]

16 minutes ago, chrisash said:

Thanks but that does not answer the question, its not if you like the machine or not, that's like asking if you like a ford focus over a BMW.

Its about if you can tell the difference in a blind test (not knowing who made what) of the stitches.

 

I don´t think you can when your knot is properly balanced in the material and you are using the same thread and needle in either machine. A 301 stitch is a 301 stitch. A singer 111 stitch line will look the same as a Pfaff 145 or Adler 67 stitch line for the same reasons. So when someone says this or that machine makes a beautiful stitch... - hell yeah - why should it make an ugly stitch? Proper machine adjustment and the choice of thread and needle and the material you are sewing are the key factors for a good looking stitch line. Machine poorly adjusted or the wrong needle or thread combination for the chosen material can make a stitch look ugly but not the machine you are using - as long as it is properly adjusted / set up for what you want to sew.

[Frodo]

2 hours ago, chrisash said:

Thanks but that does not answer the question, its not if you like the machine or not, that's like asking if you like a ford focus over a BMW.

Its about if you can tell the difference in a blind test (not knowing who made what) of the stitches.

 

 It will give you a nice pretty even stitch line that has the top and bottom stitches snugged up tight with the correct tension.

for about an inch or 2  it is a shoe patcher. it will NOT  sew a belt, It will not sew a holster, it will not sew wallets  after a inch or 2 You will have to stop and tinker with the damn thing because

again. It is a SHOE PATCHER  It is designed to sew a couple of inches to patch a shoe.  

I have one, I even have a servo on it.  I have not FINISHED a project using the patcher.  

Please fgeel free to buy one and make it run like a Porsche   

here is the best advice i can give you if you buy one.  go on youtube, seek out MANLY ACRES

[chrisash]

I don't have one and not looking at buying one

I don't expect a high cost industrial machine to be as reliable as a domestic machine

What i do expect is not the bullshit from people who have heard of them but never owned them, who crucify them out of hand as crap; and people should by something the seldom use at a price they cannot afford

If you find you cannot do more than a couple of inches or it needs constant adjustment that's fine you have one and speak from experience, but others have also stated once set up they are fine, so maybe both are right. there are plenty of comments on here about Industrial machines that wont work properly

so is the finished stitch good or bad thats all I asked

[Matt S]

1 minute ago, chrisash said:

I don't have one and not looking at buying one

I don't expect a high cost industrial machine to be as reliable as a domestic machine

What i do expect is not the bullshit from people who have heard of them but never owned them, who crucify them out of hand as crap; and people should by something the seldom use at a price they cannot afford

If you find you cannot do more than a couple of inches or it needs constant adjustment that's fine you have one and speak from experience, but others have also stated once set up they are fine, so maybe both are right. there are plenty of comments on here about Industrial machines that wont work properly

so is the finished stitch good or bad thats all I asked

I had one, I bought it when I had a particular need for a transverse-feed machine. I was hoping that I could modify and dedicate it to this task. While waiting for it to arrive I found a real transverse-feed machine.

I wasn't impressed with the patcher, though it did sew within certain limits. To give you an idea of the quality only half the supplied bobbins fitted the shuttlehook. Two bobbins still had the lathe swarf wrapped around them. When I turned over the machine sand from the mould fell out. The thread tension nuts were just plain steel hexnuts with no provision to stop them vibrating loose so the tension changed as the machine sewed. Their coarse pitch made it difficult to get the tension "just so" when working with less-forgiving combinations of thread and leather. I can't remember if the stitch length regulator (a plain steel set screw) had a jam nut or not, but that would self-adjust too. IIRC there was no way to adjust foot pressure or slip the presser bar to adjust its height.

Why do some people think these machines are fine and others junk? Well see my above comments of inconsistency -- Person A gets a lemon and Person B gets one that works out the box. What are going to be their conclusions? Person C has the skills, tools and willingness to mend and modify the machine to do what they want, Person D wants/needs it to work out the box. Also different people have different thresholds for "good" vs "junk", especially if they've never used a real industrial machine before. Some people seem to be happy with extravagant workarounds and limitations to use these machines. I'd rather saddle stitch everything.

Is the finished stitch good? Let's just say I wasn't happy enough with the consistency and appearance of the stitch that my machine produced to put my name on it. I've not yet seen any examples of work that have disabused me of that impression. I used mine for a few repairs where I had no other option (you know, being a patcher machine) and sold it on. I haven't mourned its absence.

[fredk]

Is this the type of machine youse are discussing?

 

I was thinking of buying one.

Just cos I think its rather an antiquated & basic look which I like. I doubt I'd do any real sewing on it anyways.

I can get this off ebay.uk, UK stock, for about £60 delivered

[DrmCa]

Yeah, it is the abomination we are talking about.

[Squid61]

I've looked at these off and on for a while now, yeah I'm guilty of not owning one.  As someone doing typical hobby/personal varieties and quantities of products, I've concluded I can get a lot of hand stitching done in the time I would probably spend fiddling around with one of these Rube Goldberg machines and it will look much better.  Until some outfit puts out a decent hand crank machine priced for the hobbyist, I'm a hand stitching.

[chuck123wapati]

1 hour ago, fredk said:

Is this the type of machine youse are discussing?

 

I was thinking of buying one.

Just cos I think its rather an antiquated & basic look which I like. I doubt I'd do any real sewing on it anyways.

I can get this off ebay.uk, UK stock, for about £60 delivered

I trust Frodo's impression of it!  But I've been on the fence as well. My problem is I want to buy it more for the idea of getting the piece of crap to work than to sew with it. I'm not gonna waste expensive leather on this i make to many mistakes already.

[kgg]

1 hour ago, fredk said:

Is this the type of machine youse are discussing?

That is the China Patcher, guaranteed to provide untold enjoyable hours as a Tinkers Delight.

kgg

[fredk]

Now knowing that it might need some lots of fettling to get it to work decent I might get one to play with

Its what my father used to call a Tinker-toy*

* I believe there used to be some sort of toy in the US that was called Tinkertoy

Edited November 25, 2021 by fredk

[Squid61]

31 minutes ago, fredk said:

Now knowing that it might need some lots of fettling to get it to work decent I might get one to play with

Its what my father used to call a Tinker-toy*

* I believe there used to be some sort of toy in the US that was called Tinkertoy

Actually, the US toy that comes closest was called Erector Set; a collection of nuts, bolts, perforated metal strips, pulleys, shafts, miscellaneous accessories and a real plug-into-the-wall motor.  Enough to give today's overprotective nannies a stroke!  There is a current version available but it lacks much compared to the original. 

[chuck123wapati]

22 minutes ago, Squid61 said:

Actually, the US toy that comes closest was called Erector Set; a collection of nuts, bolts, perforated metal strips, pulleys, shafts, miscellaneous accessories and a real plug-into-the-wall motor.  Enough to give today's overprotective nannies a stroke!  There is a current version available but it lacks much compared to the original. 

yea and it was great!!! when used with the potentiometer of my electric train set lol. i think it may have been my first wood burning kit too lol. Damn it was fun being a kid back then.

[kgg]

45 minutes ago, Squid61 said:

a collection of nuts, bolts, perforated metal strips, pulleys, shafts, miscellaneous accessories and a real plug-into-the-wall motor.

Great description of the China Patcher except for the motor part.

kgg

[DrmCa]

My impression is that those who buy them from China wholesale and re-sell them locally actually do a pretty good job of QC. They weed out apparently defective units and sell only those that work. If they would not, then they would have too many returns and negative feedback. I personally would never buy this unit from China directly, but since it was already present in my city, I knew that I could return it in the worst case scenario.

[Garyak]

On 11/24/2021 at 11:43 AM, chrisash said:

My question is how well it sews, we all know they are built to a low price level,

But how different is a patcher say singer 53 or older, row of stitches than a Chinese patcher that's set up properly.

If you were given two sets of stitches could you really identify what one was made by the Chinese version

They are completely different. I have both a cobra and China patcher. My patcher sews with the best out there. It excels in the fact that it can sew 207 on both ends, unlike the rest of the patchers (except Claes/pfaff) that top out at 138. A sewing machine is nothing but a tool. It’s only going to do what the operator makes it do. It’s only going to do what it was designed to do, and the China patcher does exactly what it was designed to do. Lots of folks are producing top notch leather work with it, ive never had a complaint. 4-3/4 stars when used as intended, without physical changes to the rig. Singer 29-1 thru the latest clone (cobra,techsew,Consew,etc) are all singer 29s. The China patchers next of kin is the Bradbury.two completely different set ups. 

[DrmCa]

It's hard to see the machines through the sticker camouflage.

[Squid61]

10 minutes ago, Garyak said:

A sewing machine is nothing but a tool. It’s only going to do what the operator makes it do. It’s only going to do what it was designed to do

I've had too many instances of machine tools doing other than what I attempted to make them do.  A machine, tool or otherwise, with imprecise components either by design, manufacture or wear and tear will do whatever they care to do, sometimes with spectacular effect.

[Garyak]

China leather patcher, enduro pro 220v ran 110v.  207 cobra thread- UY 180-200 22,23. 

[kgg]

27 minutes ago, Garyak said:

unlike the rest of the patchers (except Claes/pfaff) that top out at 138.

The older Singers 29k 71, 72, 73 in particular the 1949 were rated for a #25 needle but the sliding needle plate / cover for the bobbin for those larger threads only came drilled for a #24 needle which is still V207. The newer clones are I agree rated for V138 and some even less.

kgg