bruce johnson

Ron, Good question. Prior to cyber meltdown last week, we had a pretty thorough section of lively discussion on books, videos, and other resources. It will be back. In my short list in no particular order. The Stohlman series of books are good and thorough. You need them all, if for no other reason than a wide knowledge base to build on. Those books are not the end all, and Al Stohlman was A saddlemaker, not THE saddlemaker. Saddle Makers Shop Manual is my go-to printed resource. Lot of variations, but assumes a working knowledge. Videos - Jeremiah Watt series is necessary to me. About as complete as it gets. Bill Gomer has one a little more abbreviated, but good points and a few tricks. Dale Harwood has a good one too. You couldn't build one from Dale's, but once you have built a few, your next one will be a lot better after watching this one. As far as schools ????? I think you could learn how to build a saddle just like the guy you learn from teaches. The more background you have going in, the more you will learn what you don't know. Philosophy now. I think a saddlemaker has to have a definite and personal experience with the type of purpose you are building a saddle for. You have to know the "whys" first before you can do the "hows". Seat shape is critical for optimum performance, which is not always the same as rider comfort. Stirrup swing, rigging types and advantages of different styles all play into the mechanics of the top side. Fit, rigging style and position play into the bottom side. The good news, there are probably more instructional opportunities now than ever before building saddles. Everything from books, videos, schools of different lengths, classes at several leather trade shows now, and saddlemakers talking. You are in a good place right here.

Art, For everyone who has not heard the term, a "nightlatch" is something to grab onto to prevent getting bucked off. Basically something to lift against to keep you down in your saddle. As an aside, unless that guy is left handed, or reins with his right hand for some other reason, a nightlatch should be on the right side of the swells. I am not sure how that one is fastened. Some people use a loose strap buckled through the gullet. You grab it kind of like a suitcase handle. I have heard it termed a "knucklebuster night latch". as the horse is pitching his little fit, your knuckles are banging on the swells. Another style is a doubled pigging string with thetail pulled out of the eye. Double it and feed it through the gullet. Then bring the eye and the tail up through the formed loop. You grab the free ends of the string. Other guys use a similar one made from a rope or braided rope witrh a small eye. Looped aroungd the gullet and fed through the eye. Some guys feel that the firm attachment of the knucklebuster could be an issue if you do hang up a spur or toe in it on the way out. The single eye rope, or doubled string is thought to be safer, it will pull loose. Most guys are carrying a couple strings, so it is a handy place to carry one anyway. Other guys dispense with the nightlatch and pull on the rope coils. All in what you are carrying, and where you learned it at. Greg, Ryan, and some of the guys who have been around have probably seen other variations or terms.

Elton, I have used a couple quarts of it, and am on my 3rd. It is pretty good, not sure what is in it. Greg said he has the base Ron mixes it up from. Makes a nice edge. It is what I usually use on belt edges I am not going to dye. Ron sells a marking pen kind of set up to apply it with. That works OK.

Bill, I use a standard 45 mm rotary cutter. It will do everything from pig lining up to skirting for me. I use a 48" aluminum rule as a guide for it when I do straight lines. I also use the scalloping blades and pinking blades as well. Rgrbitz, 1. bench chisels that I sharpened up. I use them to cut slits of a repeatable length. I also use them to cut out inlays. Also makes a good starting slit for my crown splitter. I hit them with a maul. 2. Bench top belt sander - to true up edges and sand off glue boogers on edges. To thin tips and folds on straps when needed. Minor shaping, won't scorch easily like a Dremel or small sanding drum. 3. Bench top drill press - two of them - one to chuck mini and maxi punches to punch holes. Turn it on and try it for yourself. The other has one of Norm Lynds' edge burnishers permanently chucked. 4. I have a "third hand" clamp mounted on my cutting table. It is a leather tool, and makes holding a piece while I strip it a breeze. However on my other bench I have a toggle clamp. Barry King showed me this. They have a rubber tip and will hold the end of a strap while I pull against it to slick edges. They don't leave marks on finished leather like the 3rd hand. I bought mine at Harbor Freight for about $6. Just do a google search for bench toggle clamp to see what they look like. 5. shop press for small clicking, embossing, press molding. 6. Dremel for shaping and modifying tools, smoothing and trueing tight inside curves on leather. Keep it moving or it will scorch. 7. Auto Body dolly (oval) with handle- I put the handle in the Hardy hole of my shoeing anvil. Makes a nice stake to flatten seams inside bags on. 8. Shoeing anvil - setting rivets, it doesn't move. The horn and heel are good to set rivets inside bags with too.

Bill, From Siegel I order heavier weight tooling, skirting, USA greasy waxy latigo, lining, LM shearlings, commercial oak for lining, work chap, diamond tan, and Osborne tools. Compare the cost of an Osborne round knife there and from craft sellers. From Hide House I order lighter weight tooling leather. Exotics from Jerry VanAmberg. For TLF, I order from Clovis usually. Ed is very knowledgeable. I order the chemicals, some hardware, lining pig, some odd lots once in a while. Hoping the new guys do well with HideCrafters. I had some issues with the George and Jane show. From Ferdco - needles and thread. Hardware mostly from Walsall if a big order. Some from Weaver, but try to avoid it. Shipping takes too long to where I live and have had enough problems and uninformed telephone reps. As an aside, their mauls are not made by a local Amish craftsman. Barry King lives in Sheridan, WY. If they are the only game, then they are it. Otherwise I order their resale line from whoever really makes it. Some stuff from Ohio Travel Bag, but again not much or lately. Most silver from Hansens. Stirrups from Trina Weber. Other hardware from Bork, Jeremiah Watt, and the local tent and awning supply or surplus. Stamps from Barry, TLF, Wayne Jueschke, Jeremiah Watt, and a few from Ellis Barnes. Tools from TLF, Barry King, Jeremiah Watt, Ron Edmonds, Wayne Jueschke, Bob Douglas, mostly. Another source that has been mentioned already. Sheridan Leather Outfitters stock a lot of useful stuff. For a small order to fill in, I have started ordering there, and will continue. If I need just some rings, stirrup buckles, or whatever - they are my new go to place. Better than making an order with someone else and padding it to meet the minimum order fee, and then shipping costs. I'll be doing more business with them as time goes on.

I am probably not going to change anyone's mind here, but my 2 cents. I have been a Siegel customer for several years. In that time, in a particularly trying time in my life Siegels did something for me personally that has pretty well shown me what kind of caring people they are from top to bottom. I will be a customer until one or the other us close our doors. That said, the issue is back orders. Yep, I get from them too. I also get them from every other supplier. I have ordered from one of the above mentioned great suppliers and get zipper tape, top stops, and bottom stops. I need them by Friday so I can spend the weekend putting gussets together and assembling a bunch of planners. The zipper slides are backordered I find out when I open the box Fri. afternoon, at anyplace within 150 miles driving distance. I order from another supplier mentioned. I fill out my order to make the minimum with checkbook inserts. Ordered something like 25, they ship 23. A month later I get the other 2, along with a statement for under a dollar for the inserts, a minimum order surcharge, and about $6 for shipping. They stuck them in an envelope and mailed them for about 50 cents. I order from yet another from the list of folks above and get a full side with a forklift track the length of the side, yep it was sold as tannery run, run over at the tannery. Want to spend a fun time on the phone, talk to anyone about a return there. Order thread for top and bobbin and get two way dissimilar shades of brown neither one the color they show in their catalog. Ordered a set of edge bevelers from yet another place mentioned, I get edge creasers. I gave them THEIR catalog number, and that was on the packing slip also. I paid for shipping and was expected to pay for return shipping. I need some rigging rings, 4" bronze, a big tree and supply outfit is shipping them along with some other supplies. Friday comes, the saddle is sitting here for the re-rigging, and no rings in the box, they are held up somewhere and backordered. I am a second business. I work from 4:00 am until time to feed and go to work, then at night and weekends. When I need something, I need it too. Most of the time I need to be a better inventory manager too. These are all reputation places who have been in business a while. They are going to have problems with supplies and orders at times. I don't run a website or catalog business, but I expect that it is not a simple deal to change a site to reflect a particular out of stock item. They are dealing with someone bigger than them keeping them supplied. Little things like short supplies, bigger demands in China, clearing customs, container off loading schedules, blizzards, refused orders due to quality, all affect our suppliers. They would like nothing more than to have no backorders also. Unless they are profiting from shipping and handling charges, they are losing money too. I guess I learned a while back that I ask if everything is in stock no matter who it is. After a few experiences, it just is prudent with everyone. Moreso if I am out. Sometimes they don't know. The order taker is on the phone and the puller is in the warehouse. They have 12 sitting on a pallet, and the other phone rep just took an order for 11. Establish a relationship with the rep, and tell them you want to know about backorders, what you want for quality, what shape you need for the side (long and skinny for reins, or deep for bags, etc). At Siegels, you are talking to a rep who has probably spent time pulling orders in the warehouse and knows what you are talking about back there. I would much rather get personal and know the name of the person I am ordering from than hit keys anyday. People complain about "being a number" and then order by fax or internet when they have a telephone number. Maybe I am too old for this deal.

I would seriously consider a drop plate/flat plate/Montana plate rigging. More leather, but more stirrup swing and I think balanced pull and strength for a using saddle. I have a Ford, Chevy, and Dodge pickup in the yard, so I am pretty open minded. I have built dee ring on skirt/off skirt, in-skirt, dropped ring, EZ dee, and plates. I like plates the best for all around use. Each of the others (maybe not the round ring or EZ dees so much) have some limitations for me.

I am sure that HO and W/C are still soaking hides. If they weren't Dr Dan from Shoptalk would have it cover page news and probably put out a special edition. He was Johnny on the spot for a few other rumors that proved out to be true lately. They are right though, that nobody in the US is doing double shoulders, or at least was at last count. Regarding the stretch marks on double shoulders, that just comes with the territory on shoulders sometimes. Hides behave the way they did on the living beast. The head is going up and down all day with eating and chewing. Backs don't move much. Flanks move a lot. Some of this can be used to our advantage. For instance, orienting a checkbook, photoalbum or planner so the fold is parallel with the way the cow moved makes it easier to stretch and make that fold. Trying to fold a strap from 4" off the centerline of the back is tighter fibered and might crack at a buckle fold. Some customers think you are using dry crappy leather when they see a stretch crack, when in fact you are using a prime part of the side. Obviously warm water and working the fold can prevent cracks, but you have to know what the hide did. Bellies are thinner usually and expand and contract all day with breathing, filling up on feed and water, and emptying. They are stretchy and not as tight a fiber. Flanks are constantly moving, they are the most stretch. Some guys take it pretty far. The rumen fills up the left flank. Throughout the day on some cattle, it can stretch and contract a lot. I had one OLD saddlemaker tell us that in the old shops the foreman would cut stirrup leather for the good saddles only from right sides. They thought the left sided straps had a little looser fiber and more stretch. Old men are generally wise, and I try to follow that rule out of respect (and a good story). It is pretty important in saddle work to use a part of the hide that will work for the application. Some things need to have little stretch like leathers and riggings., Others need to mold by stretching and compressing like a swell cover. Others just sit there. Some will curl if cut from too loose area. You really learn how sections behave doing that. Shoulders are kind of unique. They flex front to back and are looser fibered than further back. They also cup over the shoulders and wrap around the neck. The lower aspects are getting down into the areas of the upper leg with some motion. It can get looser again. We cut this off the animal and are taking a bowl and making it flat. Because of the looser fibers it compresses together and makes a flatter piece. The excess can however make these ridges that are often called fat wrinkles. There are probably more wrinkles on the neck of a skinny old butcher cow than a fat steer. I think it is more a factor of excess skin than fat. Another factor are the heavier cattle and Brahma influenced breeds that get a little (or big) hump in their shoulders. Some of these shoulders are sold as "V cut" shoulders. They will have a V shape were a slice was made into them to provide relief so they could flatten out the piece. I have seen some shoulders in the flyers at times that even had a piece cut out of the center, that was excess hump leather cut out. Because of the natural stretch being front to back and less stretch side to side, most belts cut from shoulders are done crosswise. If the shoulders are long enough, they won't get into the looser ends with most belt ends. also because the wrinkles (compression) is linear with the belt, there will be realtively less stretch. When I was doing a lot of wholesale work, I did a lot of photoalbums and planners. I liked shoulders because I could orient them so the wrinkle worked to my advantage when making folds. Make the fold parallel with the wrinkle. Also the fat wrinkles on those sort of things added interest to the piece if they weren't tooled. They usually tooled OK and weren't noticeable when they were. That leather will also fold and compress and stay pretty flat. I could wet and stretch back leather OK, but when the fold was flattened out again, it wouldn't compress back and stood up as a wrinkle. Minor issue usually, but why cut hard firm leather and fight it when shoulders were less expensive and worked better for that application? There are some that argue that belts shouldn't come from shoulders. we should be cutting them out of backs where the leather is firm, less stretch on the billet ends. Probably true to a point. In reality, I have stretched faster than any belts I have made for myself in the last several years. In fact, would welcome one that gave me about an inch every few years. My next Wranglers might move me into the $2 upcharge. Probably more than you wanted to know about leather, but I am waiting for finish to dry and then set some snaps.

I started out with an Adler 205-64 when I upgraded from the Boss. It was a great machine, but had a couple drawbacks. It didn't have needle guide or center presser foot. It had a feed dog underneath that came up through the throatplate. The hole in the feed dog was fairly small. If I got much deflection with heavy leather (like reusing holes sometimes, or sewing tunnel loops onto back cinches), the needle would miss the hole and hit the feed dog. Then I for sure snapped the needle, and on occasion broke or bent the feed dog. Finally got a heavy duty feed dog that just snapped the needle. I now have a two year old Pro 2000, and a Juki 2000 when Ferdco was still using the original Juki frames. They have the bigger hole in the bottom (diamond shaped). I am with Ed, not sure how much that helps, but the center presser foot dang sure keeps the needle from deflecting much, and my backside lines are straight. I have not snapped a needle in either 2000 yet. Curiosity question for the other 441 clone owners. I have never seen the underneath of any but mine. What kind of feed dog do they have? Also for the different Artisan 4000 models, I know the head is lighter in one of the 4000s, is the feed the same in both of them and the 3000?

Dave, You asked in the thread on clickers about my bell knife skiver. I started this thread to keep things on track and more searchable in the future. I bought a bell knife skiver last spring. I have a Landis handcrank skiver, and at one time I had a pair of 3-in-1s sitting around too. I still have the Landis, and have it set up for skirting, great job getting the meat off the edges of ground seat buildups. Poor for softer leather. Originally I was going to buy one of the new skivers that Artisan. Ferdco, and others all have a version of. A friend told me of Melanie Machine in LA. Kind of a warehouse of leather machinery. I called and talked to Arnold Kay, the owner. This is an aside here. I told Arnold what I was looking for. He had the new versions, as well as a couple used Fotunas. We talked on the phone for a while, and he told me to just bring my leather and come down. He would make the 700 mile round trip worth it. In talking with other guys who have these, they universally told me that a bell knife skiver will not do a good job on vegtan leather unless you have a top and bottom feed. Those were a little over my price range. I threw some vegtan into the sack anyway, and hit the road. You have to realize that I hate driving south of the "grapevine", so Arnold impressed me with his knowledge. Melanie Machine is a museum of working leather machinery. He has one guy that pretty much just walks around dusting machines and cleaning all day. It is not your typical equipment warehouse. Arnold has been in the business for a good while. At one time he had a shoe factory kicking out 5000 pairs a day for Sears. He knows machines, and when the domestic shoe business dried up, went into machinery. He has stitchers, flatbeds, a ton of kickpresses, bandknife splitters, and clickers looked like you could crush a truck with. Arnold had a couple skivers set up for me, the new one and a used Fortuna. They both did the job on chap leather and latigo. I asked about doing vegtan, and he said no problem up to about 11 oz with the bottom feed. The key is changing the feedwheel. They all come with a stone feedwheel standard. It does a fine job feeding the softer leathers. On vegtan if it slips a little, it glazes up the wheel, scorches the backside of the leather, and won't feed. Exactly what everybody else told me it would do, including some other sellers. Arnold put in a steel feedwheel. It has grooves like the feedwheel on handcrank sole splitter. The presser feet for vegtan have rollers in them. With this combination, it feeds well. I ended up and bought the Fortuna because of the heavier casting and ease of changing the wheel. I was planning to haul it hime and save shipping. He wouldn't let me. He wanted his mechanic to change out a belt and a few springs, and tune it up. Stuff that would have taken more time than expected, so he shipped it. Good guy to deal with. I use mine for skiving edges of chap leather for seams in bags and purses. I use it to split mulehide and latigo for horn wraps. In fact I had some really heavy mulehide I split a strip and the skiving was usable also - 2 for 1. Biggest thing I use it for is thinning edges evenly on vegtan for projects. I can use heavier leather than I might for planners or checkbooks, stuff like that. I thin the edges down so they are not so clunky looking and then I put in my folding grooves. Then I have a little more meat in the tooling area than with thinner leather, and can tool deeper. I can use up more scraps that way from heavier leather. Other than a side of thin leather for wallets, I haven't bought any tooling leather under 7/8 since I got the skiver. The skiver is pretty easy to use. I dealt for the stone and steel feedwheels, and the presser feet it looked like I would need when I bought it (have used tham all too). I have never changed out the wheel, the steel will feed the soft stuff too. The feet change out easily, and adjust easily also. By sitting down with Arnold and trying the machines, I got some tips and tricks that probably aren't in the manuals too. There are still some things I handskive, but between the Landis handcrank and the bell knife, not much.

Elton, I use a hydraulic shop press. About all I plan to click is small stuff, no saddle parts, so it works for me. A piece of steel on the bed with a piece of HDPE cutting board for the base. I put another piece of steel big enough to cover the die on the leather and crank away. You only need to let off enough to slide the work out and another one in. The detracters of the shop press say that it is like jacking your car up every time. I guess it would be if one is practical thinkingly challenged and lets the it go all the way up every time. I find that 4-5 strokes will cut through my skirting, less for thinner leather. I have a 20 ton. I also use it for press molding cases, back cinch tunnel loops, stuff like that I couldn't do as easily with a clicker. I also use it for embossing plates. The cost difference from 5-20 ton is not much, but the beefier frame on the 20 ton was noticeable. When I researched this, I had a guy who I trust tell me he had broken a lighter jack, and I expect it made a mess. I trusted him and forked over the extra $40, figuring that $40 wouldn't cover my time to clean up hydraulic oil and the leather it would ruin. Then there is that whole other bad words and falling from grace issue that would probably happen too. I have dies from Big Sky and Texas Custom Die. The TCD dies are very good and I got them quickly. They were 4" round and square dies for my wife to convert my scraps into coasters and $$$. I have latigo and cinch carrier dies I ordered from Big Sky along with a few spur strap patterns. Good prices and quick shipping for off the rack dies. Good quality also. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend either place. I picked off a few spur strap dies on ebay a couple years ago also. They are the shorter dies (3/4") but work well also. Another money maker and project is that the tab end of spur straps also double as key fobs (more $$$). In the words of my good friend Go2Tex, "one man's scrap is another man's key fob". Dave, I was looking into clickers a while back, and then kind of priced myself out of one (got a bell knife skiver instead). Both Artisan and Ferdco are now selling hydraulic clickers in a few sizes, along with the other big time clicker folks. I found that the price difference from small to large clickers was percentage wise not a lot. There are a bunch of used ones around, but with what they weigh, you don't just go pick one up and try it out. There are some happy campers with the Tippmanns, and some that aren't. Not being able to move the platen looks to be a bit of a handicap to me with those. Tippmann referred me to "satisfied customer" who offered to sell me his small one. Not sure where you are, but Melanie Machine in LA had some big hydraulics. I think that the guy from TN who sells used machinery here probably has a line on some too. For saddle parts, I would talk to someone who clicks out their pieces like Crates or one of the other factories and see what they are using for clickers and die makers.

I got my modelers yesterday. Thanks to Jim and TLF for donating these. I REALLY did NOT tell Clay that the the modelers I use the most are ball modelers and the undercuts (deerfoot?). That's what I got, thanks mi amigo. I ceremoniously dumped the old ones and played Taps on harmonica. That old gray plastic coating had chipped off long ago, and the duct tape handles were not the most attractive.

YR, Nice work. A couple questions though too. Whose trees are those and what is the coating? In the pics, it almost looks like there are seams in the covering, but then it is a smooth finish? Any special concerns with the finish peeling while you are working it or anything? Also on your seat on the finished saddle it almost looks like there is a separate piece used to finish in the cantle dish. Is it my eyes, or just the way the tooling makes it look? Welcome aboard, glad you found us.

Freak, I haven't had much of a problem. I got some raggy kind of leather once that looked pretty fuzzy afterwards, but that has been about it. The label tape defintely will mess up your day. It grabs and doesn't want to let go. Carton tape has been my choice for quite while. It may make the backs just a bit fuzzy with loose fibered leather, but I haven't had the tackiness problem some talk about, and even the fuzz lays down. I mostly line things anyway. I have used 3M, Office Depot, and Staples tape with equal success. I can normally peel them all off in one piece, starting at a corner. Office Max tape was a bit more fragile. It shredded some and I never tried it again. I had more of a mess anytime I have glued the backs, like with rubber cement to posterboard or Xray film. I do so many things with basket and geometric stamping that I have to do something to limit stretch. I used to do my basket stamped belts without taping them. I would have to allow 1/8" in width for stretching. A size 34 belt would gain 1/2 -1" in length depending on the size basket I used and the leather weight. I have taken classes on floral carving where we never taped the backs and didn't get much if any stretch. I think what tools you are using makes a big difference. I used to not tape my skirting, thinking that the heavier leather would resist stretch. It took a fully stamped saddle seat to convince me otherwise. That thing grew all the way around, and took some finessing to get it to lay back in.

I am not a computer guy, and had dial-up plus at home before. Good connection speeds were 24. At times I got 14.4. I went to Verizon's cellular deal about 6 months ago maybe. I got the choice of a USB setup or the card. I went with the USB so I could plug it into my PC at home (since trashed) as well as the laptop I carry. At work I get smoking speeds, and am very happy. I can download emails quickly, and was able to watch live feed video from the snaffle bit futurity and you tube. At home I am in a different service zone. I get much faster service than before, but the youtube takes time to load, and the horsehow videos are chopped. The advantage of the USB service was proven to me last fall. I pulled off between Midwest and Kaycee WY (remote) and had 4 bars and fast speeds from the side of the road. I would have them prove what it can do at your place, if it works, great. I live within almost eyesight of town now. The only highspeed involves a dish or antennae, and hardware and setup costs. We don't want to sink that into a place we are renting. The ironic thing is our landlord is one of the guys who developed DSL and bringing it to the masses, and we can't get it on his property. Go figure.

Johanna, It is doing it to me intermittantly, I am not messing with Beaverslayer's hat and I left the tinfoil union suit at home. Will duct tape work?? Denise, As some may not know, Denise is a retired veterinarian. I am sure she has done the deceased feline incantation (we all have), but may not have as ready an acess to the makings now.

I am a groover. I groove front and back. One of the skills to be learned in handsewing is to make the front nice and even. Everything in a line, even spacing, and same angle awl holes. Then when you can make the back the same, the next level has been achieved. With good handsewing you shouldn't be able to tell the front from the back. It takes a lot of practice, riding that stitching horse and building muscle memory. Go slow, and really concentrate on even spacing and awl angles on the front. Run a wheel in the backside groove and make each hole come out in the dimple back there too. After a while you won't need to do that anymore. It ain't a race. Go slow, and gradually a rythm will come. Speed follows that. The Stohlman book on handsewing is the best instruction here. The best advice for keeping the awl coming out in the groove in back is to have the piece held solidly. I think a stitching horse is necessary if you are going to do much, and especially fine work. Keeping the groove close the jaws will minimize deflection. Using a sharp blade is paramount. There is only one blade I know of that comes ready to use, and that is from Bob Douglas. The others need reshaping, honing and polishing for me. I don't know who all is making good horses now. I have one that I think Ken Allen in NM made, but haven't heard of him for a while. An old Irish harnessmaker spent an afternoon with me several years ago. He made himself "ta home" and took a rasp to my horse's jaws to thin and taper them and make them more user friendly. He took my bad awls and made darts from them. He then whipped off 12 to the inch stitching by eye. I saw some good stitching horses at Sheridan Leather Outfitters a couple months ago that someone locally was making. Not sure who else is doing them right now.

I think it would feed it OK. You might need to back off tensions a bit. I have sewn some deertan cow on my 2000 and it did fine with it. Art??

My thoughts based on your constraints. You need the 3000. I have Ferdco's 1245. It is an awesome machine, it will do what you are looking to do up to a point. A few things that a flat bed won't do as easily. It will not do gussets in saddle bags as easily as a cylinder arm. It will not do thread over 207 I am thinking. That may be enough, might not. The 3000 will do heavier thread and the cylinder arm is more versatile. You can buy more "tack friendly" attachments for the 3000, like stirrup plates, feet, etc. You can make or probably buy a flat bed attachment to make the 3000 a flat bed when you need it. The ends of my breast collars would be pushing the limits of the 1245, it is midrange for the 3000. Either way you will get a servo motor, so that is not an issue. Neither is service and support with your choices. Tippmann's Boss used to be the entry level machine. It held its value pretty well, and when it was time to trade up, it brought back most of the original price. Almost like using it for free. I think the 3000 has taken that spot over now. If you decide later you need more reach and decide to get an even heavier stitcher like the 4000 or Ferdco's 2000, you won't take a bath on the 3000. It would also make a dandy heavier machine, and get a flatbed to do the lighter stuff. If your business goes that way, it is nice to have two machines setup for different weights.

FarmerDave asked about this in another thread. There are several methods to prevent stretch in leather that is tooled. Some leather stretches more than others, and that can be due to hide quality and tannage, where in the hide the piece is cut from, how thick the side is etc. Other factors are degree of moisture in the leather, the tooling pattern, and type of stamping or tooling done. Some geometrics will really push, and some florals, not much. Personally I use carton sealing tape in overlapping layers. It is important (I think) to use only carton tape if you use clear tape. Label tape has a much stronger adhesive and will be harder to pull off. I have used Scotch and Office Depot brands, and have seen little difference. I have also used masking tape. It works too. Other people use contact paper similarly. Many of my pieces are large, like a briefcase or ropebag. The tape is handier to put on and take off for me. I put the tape on before I wet it, and have not had a problem with it coming loose. I usually remove it after I have oiled the pieces. In the past I have rubber cemented leather to kraft paper, posterboard, and Xray film. They all do OK, too. The problem I have is that some of these are pretty unhandy for me to maneuver around my stamping rock. Some people also glue down to plexiglass, but I have the same problems with bigger pieces. It all comes down to the size of what you are doing and how big your work surface is.

FarmerDave, There are several methods to preventing stretch. I am going to start a new thread on that in the "stamping" section.

On this pattern, I generally do it with either a horizontal basket pattern or my larger block and geomtric stamps. I find it follows the "flow" of the hotizontal lines better. The first picture shows the stamp centered, and a cut line border around the makers stamp to resemble a board sign. The first few rows of baskets are also in place. On this pattern I try not to fade the stamping into the sign area too much. I want to make a distinct definition of the sign to make it appear to be standing above. The second picture shows the stamping pattern completed. It also shows a few mis-hits on the baskets. I didn't tape the back, the leather stretched, and I kept having to push it back to square. I took two minutes in the penalty box for that. The third picture shows everything beveled. I stood the beveler up a little more around the sign. I purposely made the lines around the sign a bit wavy to appear "rustic". In the last picture I have stamped the border and detailed the wood. I used a small matting tool to make knotholes, and chips out the boards. I used a stylus to add the appearance of woodgrain, and the tip to put in the nailheads. I ran a stylus through the seams of the boardss to lightly round them over and then lightly ran a skwivel knife over that trough to make the illusion of a distinct seam. There are some chatter marks showing up on the corners of the sign from the beveler. I would go over those and stamp them out. Another 2 minutes in the box.

I think it was Pete who asked how to do this pre-crash. I posted this little demo the night before cyber cardiac arrest. Here goes again. I used some scrap I had, didn't case it very well, and here it is. I do this a couple different ways, and will demo this one first. In the first pic I have centered the makers stamp, and started the pattern. I usually stamp a row at a time, and start at the top. For no particular reason, I started this one at the bottom. Once I have stamped up to and kind of around the makers stamp, I shot some faint lines to guide the stamping on the other side of the makers stamp. I stamped partial tipped impressions around the cut border and the makers stamp to fade them in. In the second picture I have filled in the pattern. In the third picture I have gone around the cut border and makers stamp with beveler. You can see that it took out the crisp outer line of my makers stamp. In the final pic, I have gone around the makers stamp and cut border with a border stamp. To crisp up the makers stamp and re-establish the outer line, I carefully reregistered the makers stamp into the original impression and tapped it.

Hilly, I have used the ProCarve for several years, and like it. It contains an antifungal, and I was having mold problems before I started using it. I have not tried the new Ecoflow alternative, and my TLF guy doesn't know for sure if it is antifungal. Does anybody know?? He was out when I last ordered, so I have yet to try it. I really started using the Procarve after a couple guys from down south told me that gear they made from leather that had been cased in Procarve failed to grow mold even on the finished product. Whatever the antifiungal is (reported to be a eucalyptus derivative) remains in the leather enough to slow mold growth? I am a little old-fashioned I guess. Most all of my stuff has been cased. I tape the backs, wet it up good, wet it again in about 10 minutes, and bag it for 8-24 hours. That leather (doesn't matter whose it is) will cut better, stamp cleaner, and give me better color. Ocassionally I have to do the Tandy class quick case, but the results are never the same as if I had let it sit and really soften, even out, and the fibers swell. It takes some palnning ahead, but the results are worth it to me. A few reasons I can think of as to why your leather seemed to dry quicker with casing solution than without. The amount of moisture may be the same, but the CS water has lower surface tension and penetrates faster. That water doesn't evaporate any faster, but will penetrate to the deeper layers faster, leaving the surface realtively more dry. The other may have to do with the leather. Some tannages with more oils hold the moisture in the upper layers, while the CS water penetrates that faster.

I sent a copy of the ebay listing to a tool guy. It is probably a Eureka pattern channeler. It is designed to edge and cut an angled channel with one one pass.