JLSleather

That IS simple. Looks good, though!

Good to see that's gittin' some use and I didn't draw a rectangle fer nuthin'

Well, much of it is based in the same old HYPE provided by "stores" and retailers about how they have "overhead" and other expenses "legitimate" for jacking up the prices of their often sub-standard "goods". Basically, locals don't want you buying online crap tax free (and now days often free shipping too) because then you might buy less of THEIR crap! And some are willing to spend CRAZY money "lobbying" to make sure you can't do that. Because 'use tax' wasn't good enough? I have no objection to "buy local".. if the charge is legit. But don't tell me about your "fancy smancy" lease payments, or franchise fees, your new car payment, blahblah.. all the "reasons" your $2 crap costs $14. I know $2 stuff when I see it If I'm buying in another state, it's because the locals either don't have what I need, or what they have is a sub-par version of what I need. But bottom line is, here we are. I guess the tax guys and the lawyers gonna make more money (again), I just don't have the time to keep up on the way-too-regular changes.

Oh, that's Heather. A couple of times she's been subjected to me I've talked to her on the phone...

I don't do checks. When I changed banks recently, they asked what kind of checks I want. Uh.. none. Would't know what to do with 'em - haven't WRITTEN a check in a long time. Nor do I wish to pay for the "service" of processing OTHER people's checks... If they can carry a check, they can carry money. If you have money to cover the check, then get your money and then show up. If you don't have the money to cover the check, then I don't know why I should pay to verify that. Since moving here, I have found TWO places where they don't take cards of any kind, which I think is more than I found in the last decade. One gal said they don't want the fees involved. Personally, I'd gladly pay the 3% to not have to have cash! Other hand, I remember that day a couple of years ago, my buddy was stompin' mad. Energy company told him they wouldn't REFUSE cash, but they add a service charge if you pay cash since they have to pay someone to make change!

A penny saved ...

Ring's Manufacturing 99 East Drive, Melbourne, FL 32904 321.951.0407

What are we doing about the EVER INCREASING number of states requiring tax collection on "out of state" sales? First of Feb (19) adds some more. You Alybammy folk, I'm talkin' bout the revenuers Yes, I know many will put their head in the sand and ignore it.. I mean the actual businesses. Really not necessary to reply to say "i'm a hobby, so I act like I didnt' get any money from it". I'm not the ignore the issue guy, but I'm also not the global conglomerate with teams of tax lawyers to handle all that in my absence.

Yup, that would work (folks usedta call them "pilot" holes, maybe now it's something more ... sensitive?). IF you decide to have a die made, I would have them add the punches for the holes too. One "hit" and it's done. Sandy's smart, she's prolly gonna recommend that you use tapped holes in the die, and then insert threaded punch tubes. It's more money of course, locating the holes in the die, but MUCH easier to sharpen or replace if they're made to come out.

I'm a bit hurry-er than that .. a bit of spray adhesive on the paper and the posterboard, stick it, and go. Eliminates errors from tracing too IF you decide you are making enough to justify a die, just make yer paper pattern, get it the way you want it, and send it to Sandy. They'll make a die right from your paper pattern.

Since you like a bit o' humor.. this actually happened. Been prolly 15 years ago.. still remember. I got a bill for an hospital visit for my son. It was marked something like "pay this now or we'll send two big guys with ball bats.. final final notice..." But i had never got a FIRST notice, so I called em. Interesting that this hospital is about 4 hours away. WHY nobody call me at the phone number on the bill, make sure I'm getting it? So the gal says it was months ago, and we're a bit mad you haven't paid it. Says she been sending me bills for months. So I said well my address aint changed, so why i git THIS one but no others? ANYWAY, that IS my name and address, and that IS my son, so just tell me what its for and we'll just do this. Says it's for emergency room visit. SO now I'm REALLY confused, cuz if it's an emergency, WHY would I go to a hospital 4 hours away?@! But she don't wanna tell me what the bill is FOR, what they actually DID. So I give her a VISA number, hear her entering it in. She says ok- that went through... thanks, blahblah.. SO I said agin now tell me what that's for. ANd she re-starts her "privacy laws".. kaint tell you ... hippa poopa... spiel. And how she can't give that out over the phone cuz she has no way of verifying that it's really me. So I SAID.. if you can't verify yer talkin ta Jeff, then you need to put that charge BACK ON JEFFS CARD until you verify it was him authorizing it. She decided there really was no trouble giving me the information.

Any time you put two layers together, they are going to oppose each other. That's a good thing..it is the point. Like plywood.. stronger than wood of the same thickness because layers are pulling each other into alignment, holding each other in position. DOWNSIDE is... your wrinkles. Unless your belt is going to always be in that (curved) position, one side of the other is going to get compressed. This also happens with UNLINED items, it's just less visually obvious due to "suede" side texture. Why you think "store bought" belts come with a "wrinkle" finish? So the question becomes.. WHERE do you want the wrinkle? Personally, if there has to he cosmetic issues, I want them on the INSIDE, where they are not seen until the belt comes off. If you make the belt on a curve -- which I did for quite a while - then straightening the belt is damaging the top for the same reason. Not good. (NOTE: I also don't like to see belts shipped in a box 8" x 6" for the same reason). I do glue belts. Generally use Barge cement, but I have more than once picked up Tanners Bond at Tandy and that works quite well. Not sure if they're still selling that now. Lots of folks talk about Weldwood cement, and I've been meaning to try that. And I glue them with LITTLE curve in them - not flat, but not conforming to the waist size either.

Dwight, hopefully I can use your numbers for an example without offending. No offense intended, just showing my train of thought. We both did our own art work, so that's all the same. We both "approved" our design, since we did it. At some point, you (or someone you know) went to a store, or clicked a web button and entered card info.. whatever ... in some manner you bought the proper paper. Maybe that's what the $8 is for? Does that include the trip and the time? I ended up paying $18.17 after tax and shipping, so 250 for $9.09 .. or $1 more than you spent. But, instead of 30 seconds per 10 (3 seconds each is pushing it, since you still have to separate and stack) adds up to 750 seconds for my 250 order, other words 12.5 minutes - and I do not believe I could separate and stack 250 of them in that time. Not that a guy shouldn't do his own -- that's a viable option for some. Your cards are clean, and I DO like that tag line ... "affordable gun leather for those who can't afford to be without their gun leather" is GOOD STUFF The idea in this thread is ... I don't wanna see somebody trying to 'smooze' me into thinking that the time he spent making cards should somehow jack up the price of the belt he's trying to sell me

I just got an email from VistaPrint that the business cards I ordered FRIDAY (it's now Mon morning) are boxed and ready to ship, complete with tracking number Amazing the things you can get done when you don't spend your day telling people how important you are For those who dont want to read my last (relatively long) post above (hey, I dont fault a fella )... that's 500 cards, in less than 48 hours, on a weekend no less, for 10% of what the local guy wanted for making less quality and taking longer. POINT IS for this conversation.. the TIME IT TAKES you may not be a legit factor. Over the years I've known quite a few people who got jobs (instead of working for themselves) because they want to be getting paid even when they arent doing anything. Money just because an hour went by. Each his own, but I don't pay people more just because the clock changed.

I can't be the only one left .... I'm always irritated by someone wanting me to log in, or sign up, or subscribe, whatever... for the simplest tasks. So I don't ask people to do that unless it's necessary. When you make a purchase, I assume you WANT it verified that it's you using your card. But if I'm really giving you something free, WHY would you need to "subscribe" for that? Yeah, I know a thousand of you just said to yourself "oh, that's normal- no big deal". And THAT is the problem. It's so common people don't notice it. But I have never thought that 'common' equals acceptable. No need for graphic examples. Yesterday, I took one of the boys for a hair cut. I generally don't do that, so I wasn't prepared to hear that yes, they have an opening but they didn't see where we had registered on line. Wait... WHAT?@! You cut hair. For money. And I have a boy who needs a hair cut. And I have money. Seems simple. SO I'll see you in 10 minutes, thank you no - I think I'll not 'register'. When we got there, they want my phone number. For what? You gonna call me when you're ready for him? We'll be sitting right over there They need our full name. How's that? You can't cut the boy's hair without knowing the correct spelling of his full name and his phone number? OUT of control. When I told them I was pretty sure SOMEBODY SOMEWHERE could cut hair acceptably without needing any of that information at all - and grabbed my jacket - suddenly one of the other girls thought that was not a problem, her scissors apparently work just fine without talking at all She cut his hair, got the store paid and a decent tip to boot. A couple people there looked at their shoes a bit. That was a "why don't the guy just tell em a phone number' look if ever there was one. Some reading this SHOULD BE rolling their eyes by now. Here's an idea - if I don't give you the number, that's kind of an indication that I don't want a call. No flyers. No sales pitch or notice of discounts. If she wants to date me, she should just say that, right? And then my number wouldn't be going in your computer anyway ... Now, this is not even tip of the iceberg view of how out of control it has become. Think you aren't being "tracked"? We replaced windows at the house -- and less than a month later we got "sale" flyers from "window treatment" vendors. (HINT: building permits are public record). The kid looks good - that girl has cut hair more than once before. But if they call, tweet, text, or tango either of us, they won't have to worry about doing it again. Oh, yeah -- you don't need his name or phone number to get it On my site you can download patterns and information and never even tell me you were there, much less your name, phone number, child's name and age, ... any of that. Can't remember what you did with it? No trouble - go download it again. And you can purchase something as 'guest'. Even if you do decide to create an account, you're never contacted. You get a notice that your payment was completed, you get another later with a tracking number. If we talk again after that, it's because YOU CHOSE to contact us.

I'm full on with ya on this. Where the water gets muddy is that batch who think that if they preach enough, make enough mindless videos, drone on long enough in enough places -- SOME will begin to say that the market should "bear" more DUE TO the per hour wage. Take a couple of examples: Like your $300 guitar strap. That is not at all unreasonable and many would happily pay that. But as a rule at $300 it will need to be a nice looking, solid, quality strap (barring some idiots who succumbed to the dumbing down of the planet and a poo-tube addiction). And though many don't like to admit it, or even talk about it, people DO COMPARE items. So the hype and pep of poo-tube only extends to the place where somebody else shows another option. The problem (relating to the original question here) is that SO many see some nice looking, solid $300 guitar straps - decide they want to make guitar straps and get paid $300 - and then offer something CLEARLY sub-acceptable and price it at $300 because "that's the going market rate" (that's ignorant enough I'll leave it at that). From a buyer perspective... yesterday I was going through the place doing all those things a guy should get done before Jan 1 Oooo... bit low on the business cards and receipt stuff. In a new town since I last ordered.. so do I want to continue with the last girl who did printing for me, or should I be looking to "shop local"? Jennifer- my previous graphic girl - is not only very talented graphic designer, but CUTE, CUTE, CUTE... so.. what to do?@! Called a couple of places here, and was told each time I would need to come in to discuss it. Really? VistaPrint does very nice business cards - quickly and accurately and for not much money - all without ever seeing me. Without ever talking to me. Just send 'em a graphic file, they send me neat stuff. But I went in. Very polite gal had examples waiting for me showing different styles. So I started out with the bottom line.. VistaPrint will do nice cards, delivered to my door, for under $20 for 500 cards. I'd like to shop local - if that costs a bit more, that's okay, as long as it isn't TRIPLE. I relayed the short version of how I just got new "maker" stamps made, and did NOT 'buy American' since the American quotes I got were late, or DOUBLE the price for less quality, or both. Other words, somebody who is INCLINED to 'buy American' was actually talked out of it by cost and service problems. After about 5 minutes of BS and "smoozing" clearly aimed at 'being sociable', she tells me that 250 cards would run about $50. The card she shows me, which is her "low end" card, was notably thinner than the ones I got from VP, and the print quality was about the same on both. WAIT.. WHAT???@! That's half the cards for 5x the price - you math ppl will recognize that as 10x more expensive per card, without any benefit increase. And THERE is the issue.. if I'm asked to PAY more, will I be GETTING more? In this case, I'd be getting less, paying more. Less versus more requires that you COMPARE. { Just a side step for a moment - time DOES matter. And the hour and a bit I killed going through all of that was more important than the $50 in question, but we weren't even to the other things I wanted yet. And the point to be made here is that while the time DOES matter, it's NOT LEGITIMATE to charge that hour to the customer -- your buyer is not responsible for all of that any more than VP is responsible for this woman's lack failure to streamline her approach. Now, I certainly could have capped that off in less time. But since she got me down here to show me some flashy colors and JACK the price - when it could have all been done with an email and a graphic file - I decided to return the favor and waste a bit of her time. I mean, really the only way she can back out of that is to admit that the face-to-face wasn't necessary to begin with. Which she won't do. I understand that a charge for graphic design is LEGIT. But the design was already done for them - just print the thing. I could do it myself, but that takes my time away from something else.} So I won't be making a purchase with that print shop. If they gave me a quote, it would include the TIME it takes, which is only going to remind me that she should owe ME for MY time. And "overhead", but I'm not responsible for you agreeing to your lease, which downtown is about 1 gold bar per square foot of space. So what to do? I called another print shop, got the same "come in to discuss" thing, and when I pressed for a BEST GUESS of how much and how long to receive, I did get at least SOME numbers. But in the end, I tired of trying to get a legit quote for a simple job. I clicked a few buttons and ordered cards from VistaPrint, which cost under $20 and are scheduled to BE HERE by Friday with a design I already approved (my design). And I ended up working until 7:00 pm when I could have been done by 5:00. My mistake -- should have done that in the first place. I'll send Jennifer a birthday card. WAIT>.. can you send cards to the girl who designs them TO the original question, I would have people asking what am I getting, and what am I paying. Each person makes up his/her own mind. Do whatever you want with your own money. Some like to pay less whenever they can. Some like to pay more, even when they didn't need to, because they think the "neighbors" will be impressed at how much they "can" pay. I'm somewhere in the middle I guess.. I want to pay as little as I can AND STILL GET WHAT I WANT. So I showed that woman an example from VistaPrint, right along side her several examples. Asked her to show me why I should buy hers instead of someone else's. Never did get an actual answer to that.. just an eventual quote for 10x the cost. But I WOULD have paid the 10x if she could show me CAUSE to do it. SO much of that these days. This morning I was looking up a Glock sumthin-sumthin. Took me to a poo-tube video, which I thought was unnecessary but acceptable. Guy droned on quite a bit, so I got coffee. When I got back, some OTHER video was playing. Pudgy boy down south showing how to make a holster ... but he aint tellin me.. just some hands on the screen and I'm supposed to read the words on the screen, I guess. Now, if you're thinkin' this post is long, you can read it in 3.5 minutes - so how long does a 15 minute video of writing seem?@! SAD part is, when he goes to price the holster, he'll include his "so important" time he spent on that video as part of what I should pay Want to sell me a holster? Or a belt? Guitar strap? Maybe a leather photo album? Whatever.... tell me WHAT I GET and WHAT I PAY. If it's not done well, no amount of discount will cause me to buy it. If it IS done well, don't be afraid to ask me to pay MORE, but be prepared to tell me WHY I should pay more. Don't include names -- unless it belonged to Elvis, your name doesn't matter. Don't link me to a video of how you made it, unless I ask you how you made it. I'm buying the LEATHER, tell me about that. Don't give me the "made by vets" speech. As a tax payer, I ALREADY paid you for that. Now tell me why your product is a better option for me than some other one. Personally, I have no issue with somebody turning this around and applying it to me (you SHOULD). Hey, Jeff -- you got a holster 'n' belt right there, but so does this guy, and that guy, and a thousand other guys. WHY should I buy yours?@! My answer might start with something about QUALITY and COMPARISON. Check out "Why are your holster prices below some others?" under my FAQ's if that interests you. The difference here is - I'm trying to HELP you, not PERSUADE you.

Every bit as nice as I assumed it would be. Seriously, this looks great - right down to the glisten in the eyes Laquer?

Just a GUESS, I'm gonna say that's dark brown with black at the edges. Applied heavy enough, the chocolate brown looks almost black .. and camera variations.... Simple project, though... take longer to get the stuff out and clean up after ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMVHrTPf1AQ

The smaller of the two stamps, just bop it with a mallet. The larger one I put in a small press due to the surface area.. and getting EVEN pressure all around. C-clamp? Maybe be okay. Worth a shot. I've seen a JILLION stamps that look like lettering on a plain background. Usually got a handle, bop with a mallet. I don't care for 'em myself --- just don't like the look. Makes my mind say "rush job" right from the start, which theoretically is not what you want people thinking when they view your work. Also, "common" graphics are a big no-no for me.... if I've seen your "logo" on every other high school football team ever -- I'm GONE

Alex did these for me. Click to enlarge ... The link to his site is below ... AM leathercraft

Like you mean a vaccuum bag? Sure, that would work. With one that small, guy could just 'finger press' it.

Well, that was upsetting. I do understand that I may have to pay a bit for "convenience". LOTS of times I needed ONE side, or even PART of one side, and went to SLC for that. It costs more than from H.O., and I don't fault them folks for not workin' fer free. Just like I pay $2 for coffee at the gas station. I know I can go home and MAKE coffee fer 12¢ (random figure) but I'm already here and they have what I want. So long as the coffee is acceptable here, all is good. The store gets paid, the vendor gets paid, and I save a trip. Havin' said that, the upsetting part is ... what I gotta do gitta girl stand by me and tell me I'm right?@! And, STILL no 'girls of SLC' calendar@!?! Kevin, Mr. Darnell, lighten up fella's .. I'm jus' playin' ...

Agreed. Sometimes I ship a box of "scrap" to somebody who can use it, or have a 10¢ on teh dollar sale, because I know I "could" probably use some of that, but the TIME I save on teh next project NOT going through scrap is worth more than the scrap!

That's quite simple.. in fact, I would not consider that holster "molded". That little Ruger doesn't have a LOT of contour in it anyway, and then you have PLENTY of room inside there (stitch line distance to the metal). IF I were going to make that, I'd probably lay it out, stamp it, then form it before the leather dries from the stamping. Just FYI, when I think "molded", I'm talking about this: And this ...