jasonsargo

Singer 111Wsv65 Info, Please...

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Hello, all.

I've spent more than a few hours in the last few months lurking and dreaming, and finally lucked into two free blind stitch hemmers on Craigslist that I turned into a trade-in for a beautiful Singer 111WSV65 with new table and clutch motor. $100 on top of the trade and I was out the door from the fantastic Ralph's PowerSew in Denver...I think I scored, to say the least. My first industrial!

I have a few month's experience with a crazy left-handed cylinder bed machine with no reverse making medical leather ankle-foot orthotics a few years ago, so I know I have a steep learning curve ahead of me, but I'm going to have fun with this one. For some reason, making a beautiful tooled leather clutch purse for my daughter to treasure and use as she gets older is my first dream project, but maybe a little upholstery repair is on the horizon, too. Staying handy for my employer with some canvas medical instrument covers in the next few weeks might be one of my first projects to rebuild my skills. I doubt I'll ever step up to holster thicknesses, but want to be ready for projects a little thicker than garment leather.

Like I said, I've lurked, and now searched, but would love help with specific info and resources to get me up to speed on this machine, whether in this forum or elsewhere on the net:

- history (I'm guessing this is a "special variance" machine from about WWII, but what does that really mean?)

- capabilities (what thicknesses and thread, etc., can this machine handle?)

- manual

- service manual

- parts / clone-parts

- accessories

- tips and tricks

- modifications to consider

Thanks for your help!

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dikman   

You'll be struggling to find specific info on a WSV machine. I bought a 111WSV77, and couldn't find any mention of it anywhere! Looking at various photos of 111 class machines, I noticed that it appeared very similar to the 111W151-155 models, so I downloaded the manuals and started comparing parts/fittings and what sort of clearance I could get under the feet. My best assessment is that it's a 111W153.

You will probably have to do the same thing to try and find out your machine's capabilities. One thing I noticed is that yours is a needle feed and doesn't have the inner foot that a compound feed walking foot will have.

SV stands for Special Version (I'm guessing that you've seen the same video on youtube that I first saw? The guy uses the term "special variance" which is incorrect). Singer made a LOT of SV versions of many of their models, and no-one appears certain just what the SV models were for - some think they were prototype models, prior to a production run, or models built for a specific function (mine seems to disprove the latter, as it seems identical to the W153). Best guess is that some of the parts are/were slightly different for some reason that we may never know.

The W models were made at Bridgeport, in the US, and there aren't any records available for them so unlike other Singers you can't use the serial number to try and trace a specific model.

Edited by dikman

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dikman   

Slight mistake in my previous post, it is called a compound feed, i.e. needle and feed dog feed the material together.

This is a manual for a 111W100, which looks like it might be the same machine? http://www.manualslib.com/manual/364307/Singer-111w100.html Looks like it's meant for material, oilskins and possibly very light garment leather - doubtful if you'll be doing holsters on it!

If you search you may find parts lists too.

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Thanks, dikman!

That really did clear up why I can't find much info on this machine. I did go back to Ralph's today to get set up with some 138 thread, and they gave me a 111W155 manual. I looked through both manuals, and my machine really looks like it shares features with both the 111W100 that you thought, and the 111W155. In fact, they said their selection of 111W155 feet will work just fine. And you are right, the alternating dogs and the needle all feed the material.

I agree, and really started to just play around with the machine to see what it could do this afternoon. 3 layers of tooling leather (I can't remember the oz/thickness) and 138 thread seemed to work just fine, but I will just have to watch for marks from the feet for now. I'll just take it slow and avoid broken needles as much as possible, and enjoy not having to hand stitch near as much! I'll try to take some clearance measurements and pictures of my new baby soon.

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"SV" can mean a lot or nothing.

Sometimes it could be as simple as a special foot or attachment fitted at the factory for a customer and at other times the machine itself had major modifications.

On both the ISMACS list and Singer Parts lists the 111w starts at the 111w100 so anything before that was most likely anything before that were pre-production models. You would have to look at serial numbers to confirm this.

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dikman   

As it's in the 111 class, there's bound to be similarities - overall size, body shape, thread tensioner, feet etc. The trick is to match what you do have to other models (the W100 appears to have the stitch length adjuster in the end of the handwheel, for instance, whereas the W151-155 is adjusted by turning the handwheel itself).

Darren made a good point about the W100 being the first one listed in the 111 class, whereas this site - http://www.strima.com/needle?page=255 - lists needles for WSV model numbers from 36 to 88!! Unlikely to be prototypes, I would think, with so many models, but who knows??

All very perplexing......

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I have two Singer books that list the needles for some of the WSV models

It does not prove anything

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Wow, great info and resources, guys. Thanks!

Yeah, my stitch selection is done by pushing the left button in the bed and turning the handwheel like the 155, but the illustrations are just slightly off in both manuals. You guys have really pointed me in the right direction, though.

Now...off to decipher what the heck a 47:45XA needle is, and if I really need them, and where the heck to find them versus the 135x17 that looks pretty standard and seems to work fine so far...

XA

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dikman   

I have two Singer books that list the needles for some of the WSV models

It does not prove anything

I only mentioned it because until I came across that list yesterday I hadn't found anything to indicate how many 111WSV models there may have been (I only knew of a couple). I know that there are/were quite a lot of KSV models, and I think I saw mention of GSV models somewhere. There may very well be old Singer books somewhere with info on the SV models, but unless people put it on the 'net it's almost impossible to find out much about them.

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Rhons   

Hi All.  I am hoping to learn anything about the 111wsv65.

I have borrowed a machine that belonged to my late brother in law.  I am trying to decide if I should

1a) try to buy it  1b) just do a one time borrow.
Either way the machine has not been treated with TLC and needs cleaning ,  maintenance, replacing missing parts.

I have a couple of large army tents that I would like to do repair on.  So that is my primary goal, but I can think of lots of projects that this machine might be good for.

Based on this thread I am look at manuals:  111w100.pdf and 111W152_W153_W154_W155.pdf

so:

2) Any idea of the $ value?

3) Is there a better operating manual or service manual I should be looking at?

4) Replacement parts:  Who is a reputable source? 

5) I have done some searching and this model # comes up blank.  What model number is most similar that I should use to order parts?

back.JPG

front.JPG

model.JPG

side.JPG

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Here is what I think....if it is a good price and you like the idea of working on 80 year old sewing machines, then go for it.  If you just want to sew a project and move on, then don't put to much time into it.  They can be really fun, and they also can drive you crazy.  One day it may sew fine then the next it may not sew at all.  You may need 5 parts, but you can only find 3 of them and the other 2 parts cost more than you paid for the machine.

1) Any idea of the $ value?

 A "typical non-SV" 111w155 machine is about $350-$600 depending on the condition and if it is working or not, motor type and extras, like needles, bobbins, lamp, thread holder, ect.

3) Is there a better operating manual or service manual I should be looking at?

I suspect that any 111 guide will be a good start, show you how to thread it and see if you can get it stitching.

4) Replacement parts:  Who is a reputable source? 

111 parts are fairly common on e-bay, and sometimes you can find "donor machines" without tables and just strip the parts, but it can be frustrating looking for parts at a good price. 

5) I have done some searching and this model # comes up blank.  What model number is most similar that I should use to order parts?

I have a 111W155 and it looks almost the same.  I am sure someone know the exact model it is related too.

 

 

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10 hours ago, Rhons said:

 

2) Any idea of the $ value?

4) Replacement parts: 

 

 

 

Hi,

 

looks like some threadguides are missing. I'ld need a closer look to see if the thread tension is complete, and I don't see the spring for the presser foot. After the looks of the thumpscrew on top of the machine I'ld be expecting a flat spring. If that is a family machine I think it should be given to you for free. If it was up for purchase I think I would pass.

To give a comparision: I paid 250 Euros for a Pfaff 145 with stand an clutch motor that was advertised on Ebay Kleinanzeigen (German equivalent of Craigs list). Asking price was 350 Euros. I offered 250 over the phone and hasslefree pickup. Machine came with a generous box of accessories, manual, thread, was testsewn on pickup and was complete and fully operational.

An Adler 5 (similar to Singer 45) with treadle base was 120 Euros, a Singer 7 with treadle base was 60 Euros and a Pfaff 345 with stand and Efka servo motor was 200 Euros incl. gas and professional refurishment.

 

Greets

Ralf C.

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dikman   

I agree with Ralf, I certainly wouldn't want to pay too much for it (and like everything, it's only worth what someone is prepared to pay). As an example, my WSV77 cost me Aus$150, but the only thing of value was the head unit, I junked the rest. The SV machines are problematic due to the lack of information available, but if you can work on one yourself then they can be good value. The 111 class are nice machines and many parts are common to the various models. While it might look like a 155 I'd be surprised if it's the same, more likely to be similar to the 151 - 154 models I would think (or earlier?). In the case of my WSV77, I went through the 151- 155 parts lists, comparing parts and construction, and while the part numbers were different the parts all appeared to be identical to a W153. Fortunately, the only parts I needed were feet which are easy to get. I would point out to the family the poor condition it's in, it's going to need a bit of work to make it usable  and that research has shown there's no information available for it. I honestly think they should give it to you if you want it, as I doubt if they'd get much if they tried to sell it.

Edited by dikman

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Rhons   

Yetibelle, Kohlrausch, dikman thank you for taking the time to give me that feedback.

 

Edited by Rhons

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Kohlrausch and I live in Germany and we have a A LOT OF sewing machines around here. Often enough within a driving range of just a few hours and hell you can make great deals from time to time when you watch the market frequently and act fast when a good deal pops up. But thats not the case in all parts oft the world. Prices for these machines depend on your local market.

Singer SV machines are often just standard machines (as it seems) with different accessories for certain sewing operations or certain customer needs and so forth compared with the "off the shelf" machines or are predecessors / low volume "prototypes" of future standard machines (no proof for that - it´s just what I have learned from comparing machines and parts lists).

I´m sure you won´t have problems finding parts. Singer 111 are workhorses for several decades already and the big big big advantage of the 111 type machines is that you most likely still can find all wear parts for them in 50 years from now. Most aftermarket parts are of good quality (but there are always exceptions).

If you buy it check the condition of the timing belt and most important - TEST SEW IT.

Keep in mind this 111 has no reverse! Due to the condition I´d pay 150 - 250 if it is NOT sewing and maybe 100 more when it is sewing and timing belt is in good condition.

Just my 2 cents ;)

BTW - for sewing heavy canvas Army tents like GP Small or bigger you may want a more powerfully / heavier machine and or / or a machine with longer arm but depends on where the tents needs a repair. You most likely have to extent the table as well. For lighter canvas M-1950 arctic tents and the like this machine will work fine I think.

Edited by Constabulary

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Rhons   

I appreciate the comments.  I guess I will see if I can get it to sew (with minimal costs) and go from there.

Thanks.

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Rhons   

Not sure if useful to anyone, but here is the Singer 111W100 manual converted to word

Singer_111W100_Rev1.docx

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Rhons   

I also have the converted manual for Singer_111W152_W153_W154_W155  I can only put in PDF.  Word version exceeds my upload capability

Singer_111W152_W153_W154_W155_Rev1.pdf

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3 hours ago, Rhons said:

I also have the converted manual for Singer_111W152_W153_W154_W155  I can only put in PDF.  Word version exceeds my upload capability

Singer_111W152_W153_W154_W155_Rev1.pdf

PDF is the preferred file format for manuals. Almost every modern browser has a built in PDF viewer. In contrast, very few non-business computers have Microsoft Word any more. It would require one to download either the free Microsoft Word Viewer, or an alternate office program.

3 hours ago, Rhons said:

Not sure if useful to anyone, but here is the Singer 111W100 manual converted to word

Singer_111W100_Rev1.docx

You might want to think about uploading a PDF version instead of a proprietary Microsoft format.

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If it's any help, these docs open fine on ipads.

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mikesc   

Software /freeware /open source .."libre office" can be installed on any windows /mac/ linux machine..and can open any microsoft word files..even the ones made with older versions of MS word..MS word itself has problems opening files made with different versions of itself...For PDF files you can use sumatra ( more secure than adobe PDF reader ) linux has an inbulit PDF reader..mac has it's own too..for android ( phones and tablets ) there are various apps that can read word files and others than can read PDF..the better of the latter ( and it is free ) is called "file reader"..any portable ebook type reader can read PDFs..I have one ( the size of a slim paper back book ) with thousands of PDF files on it , from sewing machine manuals to Terry Pratchet, goes everywhere with me..all our phones can read word and PDFs and other "ebook "formats.

"libre office" can also create PDF files from other formats..as can "calibre" ( ebook managment software ) calibre can transform files from one format to another.. ..it is available for mac /windows and linux and also in portable and 64 bit versions..totally safe..get it from calibre ( or your OS repo ) ..wonderful bit of software.

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I use Foxit PDF reader to view PDF files. But, my browsers all contain a built in reader. So, the only time I open Foxit is when i have downloaded and saved a PDF.

I am speaking about personal computers here, not Androids or iDevices.

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20 hours ago, mikesc said:

Software /freeware /open source .."libre office" can be installed on any windows /mac/ linux machine..and can open any microsoft word files..even the ones made with older versions of MS word..MS word itself has problems opening files made with different versions of itself...For PDF files you can use sumatra ( more secure than adobe PDF reader ) linux has an inbulit PDF reader..mac has it's own too..for android ( phones and tablets ) there are various apps that can read word files and others than can read PDF..the better of the latter ( and it is free ) is called "file reader"..any portable ebook type reader can read PDFs..I have one ( the size of a slim paper back book ) with thousands of PDF files on it , from sewing machine manuals to Terry Pratchet, goes everywhere with me..all our phones can read word and PDFs and other "ebook "formats.

"libre office" can also create PDF files from other formats..as can "calibre" ( ebook managment software ) calibre can transform files from one format to another.. ..it is available for mac /windows and linux and also in portable and 64 bit versions..totally safe..get it from calibre ( or your OS repo ) ..wonderful bit of software.

I love my ipad, my world is on it, including 100's of plays, audiobooks, kindle, leather patterns, whatever (and most of Mr Pratchet's books).    

I can't remember specifically downloading any particular software, but my acer laptop, which runs on windows 10 I think, apparently uses foxit.   Although, the biggest bugbear for me, is the 'will it, won't it' moment microsoft gives you when you are trying to open a 10 year old job estimate written in ancient Microsoft.   

I shall check out libre office.

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Rhons   

I guess I should have explained why I tried to placed word (Editable) versions (almost all word processing files can at least import word).  I had know idea the format would create so much attention.  These manuals are available in the original scans in PDF many places.  I converted them and cleaned them so I could use pieces of them to put together my own manual for a 111WSV65.

I thought editable versions might be useful to others.  If anyone wants an editable version of Singer_111W152_W153_W154_W155 let me know I will figure out a way to share it.

 

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